inverter question

when you plug the van into 240 volt van park etc.
there is an inverter that turns 240volt into 12 volt for the light etc.
sorry wasnt thinking about the power point thats a different thing.what i should have said
if im only using small things can i plug the inverter to run the van eg a lead from the inverter to the 240 volt inlet outside the van.
without damaging the jayco inverter/charger
im getting old and forgot to put half the question on lol
cheers

thanks that what i meant.
so if the inverter was plugged into the van from the outside inlet
i know my onboard jayco inverter would be trying to charge the battery im using the inverter off(im confusing myself)but if im only using low wattage 240
volt things for a short time and then solar?genny charge would that be ok.
reason being daughter likes a movie before bet and we like to listen to back ground radio and i dont want leads running all around the van and i dont want to run a gennie.
cheers

Hi Serendipity
RE:"I have a solar panel on my camper, that runs through a regulator to power my batteries. Then I do have an inverter (1000w) fitted in my camper that I can plug 240v appliances in. I choose to only use the one outlet from the inverter as I am very wary of 240v when out camping away as the inverter is not running through an earth leakage or RCD - it is plain raw 240v and I need to be careful with that when camping. I even have a large isolator switch attached to my inverter so it won't accidentally get switched on."

Congratulations

You are aware of the risks & follow recommended practise
Peter

RE :"nowimnumberone posted:
thanks that what i meant.
so if the inverter was plugged into the van from the outside inlet
i know my onboard jayco inverter would be trying to charge the battery im using the inverter off(im confusing myself)but if im only using low wattage 240
volt things for a short time and then solar?genny charge would that be ok.
reason being daughter likes a movie before bet and we like to listen to back ground radio and i dont want leads running all around the van and i dont want to run a gennie.
cheers"

Sorry, but I am having difficulty uinderstanding your aim

But I will just make these points

The inverter should not be plugged into the van inlet, it will attempt to run anything that is switched on as Peter has explained

It has an added risk of possible electric shock under certain fault conditions & your RCD is not operational

It also breechs a basic safety rule when using such devises

THAT RULE IS "NEVER CONNECT MORE THAN ONEclass 1 devise @ any time "

A class1 devise can be assumed if it is fitted with a 3pin plug. when the van is connected it itself becomes that FIRST class1 devise

If you must use an inverter connect it straight to the battery& only use ONE class1 devise @ anytime.

You may use multiple class2 devices [2pin plug] direct from the inverter with a high level of safety.
Peter

Hi numberone.

So you've got an inverter running off the battery which then gets charged by the inbuilt charger which receives power from the inverter.

There's no problem with that except for the battery to see an extra drain (on top of the DVD player and radio drain).
How much extra drain depends on the rating of your battery charger.
Multiply the inverter's and charger's efficiencies, say 0.8*0.8 equals 64%, so you're wasting 36% of charging power.
Say it's a 10A charger (140W), then the battery sees an additional drain of 50W, or 4 amps.

I'm wondering, isn't there an on/off switch on the battery charger?

cheers, Peter

sorry about the confusion
the battery charger im talking about is the one that jayco fit setec inverter.
im not running any other charger.
if i was to run a lead from the inverer (new one i bought) to the outside 240volt inlet on the van the setec runs automatically so the 12 volt lights work.
so if the new inverter was plugged into the van the setec will be charging the battery automaticaly.
if all the other power points fridge/microwave/hot watter system were unplugged the only thing running would be what i plug in tv/radio.
looking like i might have to run leads etc the thing im trying to avoid
cheers

that's ok numberone,

I think it's all understood.
The battery charger is built in and always charges the battery if 240V comes in from the outside.
So if you 'make' 240V from your battery (by inverter), and use part of the 240V power to 'charge' your battery, then this portion of battery power is on a mary go round trip.
Every time it passes the inverter/charger combo, it loses 34% of substance.
But because the built in battery charger keeps its charging power constant, the battery sees 34% of extra drain caused by the charger feeding back to the battery via the inverter.
There's no problem with this, except for the battery seeing an extra load of about 4 amps.
If you could somehow turn off the built in battery charger, then there'd be no wasted battery energy.

Does this make sense?

cheers, Peter

yes it makes sense.
the setec charger can be unpluged/switched of but i wont have any lights.
but thats ok were outside at the fire and daughters watching dvds.
so is what im thinking doable.
and can you see any problems with what im thinking.
thanks again

Yes numberone,

turn off the charger.
BTW, if you've got 240V inside the van (supplied by the battery/inverter), you can use any power saving 240V light source, can't you?

cheers, Peter

no all the light in a jayco are 12 volt
i could get a 240 lamp if needed and use an energy efficiant globe
thanks again

yes, any plug in type 240V lamp, maybe a compact fluro.

And last but not least:

You've noticed the other posters' warnings about using 240V from an inverter.

Because one of the 240V wires inside the van, or in the appliances connected to it could develop a short with the van's structure, the other wire would then become 'hot' or 'life'.

In case someone touches that wire, there's potential for a fatality.

cheers, Peter

I think you will find that what he is talking about is a Converter. Converts 240 back to 12volt. Thats how the Jayco i owned was set up. As Pauline would say PLEASE EXPLAIN??
Duke

The term "inverter" ( or converter for that matter) in electronics can cover a vast number of electronic devices for a vast number of purposes.

We have inverters that are intended to produce 240V AC from 12 or 24V DC

WE have battery chargers that use inverter technology to make a DC charging voltage from 240V rather than conventional transformer bassed technology.. they are probably best called battery chargers.

We have "Inverters" in airconditioners that allow the motor speed to be continuously varied.... in industry we would call them "variable speed drives"

In fact in this day and age the majority of the power supply units in electronics are in fact inverters or as we would more frequently call them "switch mode power supplies"

There are some realy funky and complicated devices that go under the name of "inverter"..like universal power supplies that will take almost anything from a variety of sources and output the desired usefull voltage.



This " inverter" word is getting pretty commonly used for all sorts of things so we are wise to investigate the function of any device called an "Inverter" before we draw any conclusions.

cheers
.

Thanks for the heads up Bantam, i am afraid all this Technology is leaving an old Fart like me behind.
Cheers Duke

Don't be afraid of the "technology", Just ask one simple question.

What does this thing do?

And forget about all the hype and fancy words.

cheers