TF Rodeo 2.8TD problem with heater/fan/ac
Submitted: Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 22:03
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spooler
Hey guys, I have a problem that I can't seem to nut out.... in fact I don't even know
where to start!!!
I have a 1995 Holden Rodeo 4X4 Single Cab. It has the 2.8TD Isuzu engine with 270000km on it and it runs fine.
My problem started about 3 months after I bought the ute and has gotten more frequent to the point when it's rare that it isn't present. Basically, I will be driving along with either the heater or AC running and then it will stop and the dash will show what looks like the sump, brake and battery lights (picture attached). Sometimes you will drive along and the lights go off and you can use the fan again but not often these days.
I have checked all the fused and they seem to be fine. The battery is brand new and charges fine. It is overdue for a service which I will be doing this week (have all the oils etc) and will also clean out the throttle body cause it looks gunged up.
Just thought someone on here might have seen this problem before and be able to help me out. Thanks in advance!!!
Andrew
Reply By: spooler - Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 22:12
Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 22:12
Well it seems I can't add a picture...... :-(
AnswerID:
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Reply By: Kimba10 - Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 22:22
Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 22:22
My old lux did that, had all the lights come on the dash eg, brake light, filter light, and a couple of others and thought what the hell is going on, did it a few times and my old bluebird did the same thing. Turned out to be the alternators/regulator playing up. May have nothing to do with your problem but just what I experienced even though I had no light before or after indicating my alternator was playing up..............
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: spooler - Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 22:41
Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 22:41
Cheers for that
Kimba, can you tell me, did this affect your fan or AC? As far as I can tell the only thing that happens when the lights come on is the fan and AC don't work :-/
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Kimba10 - Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 23:26
Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 23:26
In my bluebird yes, the old lux for the life of me cant remember if it affected the A/C or not !!! Sorrry ...............
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Tony H (touring oz) - Wednesday, Oct 17, 2012 at 23:48
Wednesday, Oct 17, 2012 at 23:48
Betcha....... London to a brick it is the alternator...on Isuzu's the interior fan wont run if the alternator isnt charging.....dash light/s coming on warning of elec problem..... will be problem with brushes as previously mentioned.
Let us know how you go!
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: spooler - Thursday, Oct 18, 2012 at 00:01
Thursday, Oct 18, 2012 at 00:01
Hi Tony,
How long do you think it would take for the battery to flatten if the alternator isn't charging the battery though? It's been going on the same battery (even if it's a new battery) for about 4 months now and starts first pop with no slow down in the cranking. I would have thought that it would flatten the battery rather fast given the radio, lights and fuel pump etc are always required :-/
Either way, I think I'll stick a multi meter on the terminals and make sure it's charging.
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Tony H (touring oz) - Thursday, Oct 18, 2012 at 00:08
Thursday, Oct 18, 2012 at 00:08
Its not a case of the battery going flat & the fan not running.... there is a switching relay that has to be closed for the fan to run if the alternator isnt charging the relay will be open & the fan wont operate
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: spooler - Thursday, Oct 18, 2012 at 00:54
Thursday, Oct 18, 2012 at 00:54
Hmmm.... ok. This electrickery is confusing for me I think :-P I just assumed since it's been like this for a while then the alternator wouldn't have been charging the battery and the car wouldn't start.
Will have to take it somewhere and get the alternator checked out..... sounds like this would be a cheaper and easier fix than the fan option :-P
Thanks again for
the tip :-D
FollowupID:
772618
Reply By: Ross M - Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 23:07
Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 23:07
That sounds remarkably like the brushes in the alternator are worn out or sticking. At 270,000km I would go for worn out brushes because, as you said it charges ok.
But it isn't charging when the intermittent problem happens, that's why the lights come on.
NO charging sometimes.
New brushes, while your at it give it a birthday and fit new bearings too.
Cheers
Ross M
AnswerID:
496825
Follow Up By: spooler - Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 23:31
Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 23:31
Ah crap..... I feel that I may have added confusion to the subject by not clarifying something..... the fan/AC I am talking about isn't the actual motor but the fan inside the car on the dash board :-/ Sorry if that's the case :'(
If you weren't confused and still think it's the alternator then why would it only affect the dash fan?
I appreciate all the answers guys so keep them up :-)
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Follow Up By: spooler - Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 23:32
Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 23:32
Oh, I also posted on another site which lets me add a photo so if you are curious you can see the dash lights here:
http://
forum.australia4wd.com/index.php?/topic/26307-help-1995-tf-holden-rodeo-problem/
FollowupID:
772541
Reply By: Member - kwk56pt - Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 23:37
Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 23:37
There is a screw directly above the fan motor that holds the outside vent panel down. The screw is on the passengers side on the outside, the one closest to your left fender. It screws into a plastic retainer.
Water drips into the fan via the screw. The bearing bush rusts and usually trips out the relay due to the extra load. Check you passengers foot
well for
water, if there is moisture there its a good chance you need a new fan motor and maybe a relay. The fan motor is not a serviceable unit. You can add oil if you like but the fix will be a new fan motor.
If its dry just remove the screw and fill the hole with silastic and replace the screw. I will be surprised if its not leaking
water in. The problem is that common that you will have difficulty finding a second hand one even at the extortion prices the wreckers ask
The relay is black and square and lives behind the glove box. Might be something else but start by pulling back the floor covering on the passengers side to check for moisture.
Be aware that the low sulphur diesel which reduces the lubricity of fuel will manifest itself soon in the form of a expensive fuel pump overhaul.
Mine got a crack in the head at 276000 even though it had never been overheated in its life, changed oil every 5000km too. Its worth thinking about looking out for a 97 model with lower kms say 160000kms before you get in much deeper. Not much goes wrong but when it does it can be expensive. Some make it to 400000km plus but if you go looking for a second hand fan you will find many rodeos at the wreckers that are not accident damaged.
Good luck............Peter
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: spooler - Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 23:55
Tuesday, Oct 16, 2012 at 23:55
Wow..... thanks for that wealth of info Peter!!!!
It's dark here at present but I went and looked under the floor and it is bone dry. Couldn't quiet get my hand down into the
well but looked ok. Honestly I thought it would be wet cause it sits outside in the rain a lot.
I will pull the cover of the fan unit tomorrow and have a look at how easily the ran spins and also if there are any lose wiring. When the fan is working it doesn't appear to be struggling but I suppose those fan units are pretty susceptible to increases in load that may not be heard from the cab.
Is there any way to test the relay? Can you replace it with say the heater relay from under the bonnet? I am a bit of a novice at the electrical side of maintenance :-P
I am hoping the car will last cause apart from being used as a P platers 'fun' bus by the last owner he was also a mechanic and replaced the
water pump and did all the brakes. I only bought the ute to cart my dirt bikes around so it doesn't see a lot of use. Either way, it's been the best buy I have had at $4000 :-)
Fingers crossed I can at least narrow down the problem!!!
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Member - kwk56pt - Wednesday, Oct 17, 2012 at 00:12
Wednesday, Oct 17, 2012 at 00:12
You need to remove the glovebox. There is a square bakelight black box that is the heater relay. I would try and run the fan and feel the relay or when the fan stops pull over and feel the relay, its probably hot. The fan will seem to spin freely, I was puzzeled myself thinking there was nothing much wrong with it Pull the glovebox out and ask a auto sparky to test the fan to see how much current its drawing. I would think the relay would blow when the problem gets worse. The fan is expensive so getting a opinion on its current draw should only take a few minutes provded you have removed the glovebox.
Getting the fan checked is a good cheap place to start.
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Member - kwk56pt - Wednesday, Oct 17, 2012 at 00:23
Wednesday, Oct 17, 2012 at 00:23
That screw is right at the top. The
water that enters in front of your windscreen is in a seperate chamber. The fan has its own snorkle in that chamber. The screw is directly over the top of this snorkle chamber where the fan draws its air. It just lets a drip of
water in every now and then. You can run a hose over the top of the screw and still may not see any
water enter but it will at some point of the vehicles motion.
The relay is a symtom, its getting hot because the fan is labouring and drawing a lot of current. The fan will be the probable root cause.
FollowupID:
772545