HF radio & 27MHz cb

They sure can. I have my Codan 9323 set for all 40 27MHZ channels. Not only that but it allows 10W for some reason. It works great. They run upper sideband or you can get them modified for AM and lower sideband. But given SSB goes about 5 times further and nearly every 27Mhz runs SSB why would you.

I'm not sure of Barrett or other models.

Yes of course they can. What was I thinking?
Dependant on programming of course.

One thing to remember - It is illegal to transmit 100W (most radios) on CB. In fact it is only legal transmit 5W without special license. And (I think, do not quote me on this) 25W with special license.

Ok. So to keep it legal, can an hf radio be programmed to reduce transmit power for the 27mhx cb frequencies?

I think you will find they won't allow high power transmission in the AM CB band.

"Ok. So to keep it legal, can an hf radio be programmed to reduce transmit power for the 27mhx cb frequencies?"
Theoretically yes, but practically even "low" power on HF radio usually too high to be legal. For example Barrett 950 doing 25W in "low" and it way too much. I am not sure if it possible to change it using software and honestly no-one would care about 5W from HF radio. Also 27MHz CB is almost dead, so I would not be concern bout it.

On the contrary KSV, there are 2 reasons 27mhz is great, one is the range, even at 5w, the other is that as you indicate no one uses it. It is much better than hearing every censored word known to man every 20 seconds.

"On the contrary KSV, there are 2 reasons 27mhz is great, one is the range, even at 5w, the other is that as you indicate no one uses it. It is much better than hearing every censored word known to man every 20 seconds."

Cannot disagree with you that it is great because no-one use it. Tgough "great range" is highly antenna dependable and sound quality quite inferior to UHF, though perfectly usable. I never could get much more then line of sight from 27 CB using 5W transiver with 1.5m antenna mounted on car. Though CB USB definitely has far more potentials.

As to the Codan and Barret radios being "physically" capable of transmitting on 27Mhz I would be quite surprised if the answer was a definitive no. All things are possible, including software and hardware modifications, given sufficient resources, time and money.

I am fairly confident that neither the Codan nor the Barret radios in question are legally allowed by ACMA to transmit any signal at all on 27Mhz. Listen yes. Transmit no. As far as I know, and I am happy to be proven wrong with a quote or specification etc, they are not type approved for that band by ACMA.

Why do we have these licences and frequency/band restrictions;.
The radio spectrum is managed internationally by the ITU (google it), and locally on our behalf by the ACMA. Austrakia is a signatory to the ITU regulations. The ITU regulates who does what and where on the whole electromagnet specrum. It is controlled in this way is so that everyone can have a "piece" of it to happily communicate without stuffing up each others "conversation" or whatever. I don't think that you would like it if I started chatting to a mate on channel 7's frequency right in the middle of the Bathurst race. Would you? I damned well wouldn't. Thats why the spectrum is controlled. Not quite an old rule but a very up to date and important one.

Can they be retuned YES. Is it legal NO.

But like a lot of things including "Raod Closed" signs there are people who just couldn't give a rats and go ahead and do as they wish.

Phil

"As to the Codan and Barret radios being "physically" capable of transmitting on 27Mhz I would be quite surprised if the answer was a definitive no. All things are possible, including software and hardware modifications, given sufficient resources, time and money."

Trust me Barrett out of box can do SSB (LSB and USB), AM, CW and FSK from 2 MHz (I think 1.8 actually) up to 30 MHz. And even more with additional hardware. Plenty of settings disabled via software and can be easy enabled without hardware modification. Though I agree with your sentiments regarding "Road Closed" - it is not a question if one physically can or cannot drive on red light, it is just that - illegal.

However I personally believe that things like HF radio should be unlocked and be able to transmit on any frequency for emergency reason - at the end of the day it is perfectly legal to transmit at any frequency and by any modulation in case of genuine emergency. Nothing physically can stop a gun owner going out and shoot down street just for fun, but somehow it does not happens. Same should be applicable to HF radio.

I can imagine the chaos on HF. It would be worse than the woodpecker. There is a very large number of people in the 4WD fraternity who would love to have an unlocked HF radio. Just as they flaunt the RTA vehicle rules that arent important so they would also flaunt the spectrum reservations. You know the ones.

Cannot agree. We already have enough good reliable facilities for emergency comms. And I would put the 4wd HF comms as the hardest to use. Still a good unit but could be difficult if an execperienced stranger has to use it. Sat phones you dial a number. Even call home if needed and take it from there. SPOTs and EPIRBs you just follow the simple instructions. Wide open HF transmit is not needed. This is exactly why I have not put my 100 watt Icom IC751 and tuner with full HF band transmit in the car.

Phil

Nonsense. As per given above example - we do not have random shooting on streets each evening, albeit there are plenty of firearms on hands. Another example are HAMs - they have ability and they are capable transmitting on any frequency, yet there is no "chaos" on air.
Instead of close everything and anything we need to educate users and perhaps need licensed them. Foundation license jump on mind immediately.
I do not have satphone and do not like to have one - not only cost prohibitive, but also it is not that reliable and depends on carrier. EPIRB also not getting my favor - there is no bloody feedback! You activated it, but you do not know if help on the way and how long to wait. And again it relays on infrastructure. From other hand having just one unit (I mean HF) I can call home, call for global help if I am in deep sh1t, and yet I may call fellow HF users - they may be around corner and I may need just a pull! You would not activate EPIRB if you just bogged yourself would you? Some of us get over-fascinated with all this unnecessarily gizmos, forgetting that KISS is fundamental principle for survival. People going places relaying on iPhone navigation without paper map - how stupid is that!
HF is the most reliable for emergency communication (why do you think military, aviation, police etc still use radio and there is no signs that they will resign it anytime soon?). And having radiotelephone almost obsolete because of satphone I would say lets get HF users educated and licensed and forget about all this stupid restrictions!
YMMV though.

I get a bit tired of the comments about "educating" people in the expectation that they will do the right thing. They know already what’s right and wrong but don’t give a stuff. Why would they change.

Our sat phone cost us just under $500 and we have spent about $30 on prepaid units on it since we got it two years ago. No loss of signal or trouble in all that time. Usage was only for location/GPS emails to home and two quick phone calls. That is a lot cheaper than up to $3000 for a 4WD HF set with autotune plus yearly membership fees. No yearly or monthly fees for our sat phone.

Good point about KISS. That is why I believe the satellite phone is easier than the Codan or Barret radios. I wouldn't even know how to use one. What channel do I call on and even if I knew what channel how do I select that channel. But a phone can be used by anyone. Just dial 061 and then the full phone number. Even the family or a mate can be contacted. When you turn it on the screen tells you what to do. In any event full emergency instructions are stuck to the back of our phone.

I agree about the epirbs etc. Imagine the whole sheebang coming out and all you say is "I just ran out of fuel". You need the feedback that phones and radios give.

Since Project Parakeet the military have been moving more comms to the higher frequencies and satellites. Imagine trying to get a full high definition video signal back from the front line including full duplex voice and sensor monitoring. Bandwidth for this service would be in the Mb and on HF we only have 30 of them. There isn’t enough room on HF for it. Thus all this high tech stuff has gone to higher bands. Even the HF station at Belconnen in Canberra has been pulled down and not replaced. Replaced by cable and satellite stuff. I know because one of my last “cool down” jobs before I retired was as system control on some links to the middle east. I remember the requests vividly. “Hey Phil How about swapping to the Collingwood game”. It was a pleasure and a rewarding job to help them when I had “been there” myself.

I wouldn’t say that HF is the most reliable. It can be obliterated by just a noisy (static) generator or even your own car that you may have to run while on the radio. A storm can stuff it up and good old Sol can obliterate it for hours. VW beetles were the worst offenders. My pace maker can be monitored over a phone connection. That cannot be done over HF or any radio circuit.

Phil (retired with sore fingers)

Mate, courses for horses. If you believe that everyone doing wrong thing, then that indicates to me that you OK do to wrong thing by yourself. I been tossed between satphone and HF when I was in preparation to cross Simpson Dessert. I choose HF and never regret. It is far and way cheaper then satphone alone, forget about plans and usage - I cannot get government rebate. Second hand set cost me about $1000 fully installed (I did it by myself) and unlike satphone HF was working 20 years ago, it is working now and will be working indefinitely. You cannot say the same about modern technologies that changes virtually annually. If you technically short-minded, then it is just not for you, but it does not means that it is not for everyone else - I cannot see any trouble to find suitable frequency and dial desirable phone number.
And indeed HF is most reliable - I can make reliable contact from Melbourne to Perth on routine basis. And do not tell me that satphone is flawless - it affected by terrain (virtually useless in alpine area while you in deep valley) and does not work that well under heavy clouds or even under heavy foliage for this merit. From other hand if my HF playing funny today because of thunderstorm, I am positive that it will work flawlessly tomorrow.
As I said - courses for horses and if you do not know how to use HF, then you certainly cannot appreciate one. So please do not bush and trash it. Just enjoy your satphone.

This is redicilous I never said any such thing. "Everyone doing the wrong thing". I just said that there was always some that dont want to do the right thing and educating them will not change their ways. AAAAAGGGGHHH

Stupid argument and I dont ant anything else to do with it.

Phil

This is what you typed:

"I get a bit tired of the comments about "educating" people in the expectation that they will do the right thing. They know already what’s right and wrong but don’t give a stuff. Why would they change."

There is no indication anywhere that you talking about minority. Quite on the contrary - you phrased it in such way, that if everyone have hands on "unlocked" HF, then majority will immediately and immensely abuse it. I MAY guessed that you talking about small minority, but instead used it as counterargument because I plainly disagree with such statement - in outback I met more good people then bad ones. I sorry for you if you have opposite experience (here is intended sarcasm and exaggeration).

Cheers

And yet one more word about reliability HF vs satphone. We have end-user equipment, namely HF radio that made in Australia at or almost at mil-spec vs satphone handset that is consumer product of chonoze origin. I have no doubt what is more reliable. Next is other point of contact. With HF even if all base stations became dead, I still get fair chance to contact other HF fellow user - in fact all system as reliable as my HF radio. With satphone we have satellite and provider. I understand and agree that equipment on satellite made very well, but it is just ONE satellite for everyone (may be more, but still one at any given moment is visible). Also I understand that provider has far more resources to support system then myself supporting my HF set, but again it is just ONE provider that I relay on. As result whole system became less reliable - miserable amount, but still. Now if I have "open" HF I can contact other people (RFDS for example), but if you have problem with your provider, you have absolutely no chance to use other one (I am not sure what they doing with 0011 though) and if something happens to satellite your satphone will worth less for surviving then my napkin.

KSV Now you are changing the goal posts yet again. Who said anything about end user equipment. I was taliking about the HF style comms and satellite based comms. Fair dinkum mate stay with the argument.

I have had enough. This is getting rediculous. From a comment about the reason why HF is regulated and transmitting users need licencing we have a come to someone talking about the quality of Australian verses OS goods. Aaaggghhh

Cheers

Phil

YOU typed "I wouldn’t say that HF is the most reliable."

But cannot agree more - enough is enough.
Cheers, I am out of this thread.

Happy new year

Wrong. All of then can do AM. AM is simplest modulation and exist even in very old transceivers. It may be locked by software, though.

My 9323 won't do LSB or AM, it is not an allowed option in programming. Pretty sure none will unless they are overseas models or owned by a licenced HAM

"My 9323 won't do LSB or AM, it is not an allowed option in programming. Pretty sure none will unless they are overseas models or owned by a licenced HAM"
I cannot comment about Codan (have Barrett), but trust me even if you cannot program LSB or AM from front panel it is not because your radio do not do it, but because it been "locked" via software.

A 9323 is a model for Australian Land mobile use, it is locked out regardless of front panel or PC programming. Other models with different part numbers do allow LSB and AM ( eg 9360?)

"it is locked out regardless of front panel or PC programming"
I do not think you right - it is virtually impossible to remove hardware responsible for AM or LSB without altering other functionality. As I said I do not have hands on experience with Codan, but I guarantee you that LSB and AM most certainly can be unlocked via software; at the worst case scenario one have to open box and set (or remove) few jumpers. Radio itself is perfectly capable - it is not economically feasible for Codan create different hardware for different needs - everything controllable in much simple way.

You are right, no have little or no experience with Codan 9323's obviously.

If you want this functionality you need to upgrade it to one of several models inc the one I mentioned. To get that you have to live overseas or have a ham licence as I said originally

"You are right, no have little or no experience with Codan 9323's obviously.

If you want this functionality you need to upgrade it to one of several models inc the one I mentioned. To get that you have to live overseas or have a ham licence as I said originally"
And you obviously have little or no experience in electronics. Particularly modern processor controlled ones.

Upgrade could means simple reprogramming of main controller. And it could be done via software. If your software cannot do it it does not means that Codan's cannot do it. Or Codan may have special board that by-pas that blockage to suck more money from customers.

Repeating last time:
Physically radio is perfectly capable of mentioned functionality - it is been artificially locked. Period.

Ok you officially have the last word.

That is correct. I also have BBC, Radio Australia, BoM marine forecast, ABC short wave, I have many others but have never heard anything on them.

But your only allowed to have transmit frequency's in your radio your licensed to use or the men in black from ACMA will get ya.

I think this stems from a old bit of out dated law dating back to the 40's and 50's when it was illegal to have transmitting gear you were not meant to have in case you transmitted to the enemy.......

There must be that many HF land radios floating around that MAY be illegal and the owners don't even know.

Whether it would stand up in court is another thing.

May I ask you name of the dealer? Just to know where I should never go :-)
Your radio has to be unlocked for you to be able to program new frequencies, so be aware that your dealer may want to lock it during "reprogramming".
You right - you can only use existing labels and to add new ones you have to use software. This software not freely available, but search around - few people have their hand on it. I unfortunately do not :-(

i wouldnt go back to south of the river