Using daytime running lights
Submitted: Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 09:11
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Slow one
Has it come time for us to all use headlights or daytime running lights in the day. Over the years the number of trucks and vans has increased by quite a bit, also the length of vehicles has increased.
I have seen many answers that state, if you can’t see an oncoming vehicle you shouldn’t be driving,
Well, there are a lot of reasons for not seeing the vehicle such as the sun behind them, vehicles blending in with the surrounds, heat haze, shadows, distraction and just being plain being tired. In passing any considerable length vehicle we all know how long we are on the wrong side of the road and if your passing maneuver is half way through and you then spot an oncoming vehicle, things can become very ugly, very quickly.
Many will have noticed that the Led daytime running lights on euro vehicles are easier to see than headlights, in fact they on reading an article in PowerTorque they state that the led lights emit much more light that is directed at the other vehicle. One problem with this, is if you install aftermarket Daytime running light the retards of this world will use them at night, causing problems for others.
In the article and this is their quote.
“From in depth accident studies that failing to see another road user in time (or at all) is a contributing factor in 50% of all daytime accidents. For daytime
intersection accidents this increases to as much as 80%.”
I personally hope they bring in the lights on all new vehicles, and at least require all older vehicles to run with headlights on. Many at present don’t even seem to be able to turn them on around sunset and sunrise.
Reply By: The Bantam - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 09:39
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 09:39
I don't think that daytime running lights are as necessary here as they would be in europe or northern america.
In those
places light can be marginal for much of the day for much of the year.
Like those fog lights that people like to run with their headlights, in this country I don't think they are a help for most of us most of the time.
As for this failure to be seen.......the europeans are pushing this one right across the board.
That is why every man and his dog is wearing High Visability clothing.
I think if large numbers of cars ran daytime running lights the safety effects would be deminished to the point of being pointless........like it is with High Vis clothing.
Not long ago, the only people who wore High vis clothing where those who where engaged in activities where there was clear risk involved and
bright clothing helped with that risk.
Now we have a situation where High vis clothing is so common that it has become devalued...to the point where criminals wear it when they want to blend in.
Let me tell you some of the
places I work, If I don't want to be noticed I wear High Vis...I become just another one of those yellow men.....we have done tests.....the management on these venuses know is
well.....but if two of us walk along one in high vis and the other in plain clothes.....the one in plain clothes will get a smile and a wave the one in high vis will simply be ignored......and we have rung the changes to
test this.
Not so long ago, if there was someone in a car park or on the road side in High Vis they where going something......like diging a hole...now it is more likley they are just taking the shopping to the car or walking
home.
These people who say that there are accidents where not being seen was a contributing factor do not want to admit that the reason that what ever it was was not seen, most of the time is that the person at fault DID NOT LOOK....no amount of high vis or daytime running lights will solve that problem.
Just for thaught......all these extranius lights may in fact obscure things or be a distraction.
many years ago, I saw an exibit at a science museum that showed without a doubt that visability would be improved if we all turned our headlights OFF at night on
well lit streets.......bet ya that never saw the light of day in the road safety press.
No we don't need yet another european nanny state idea.
cheers
AnswerID:
535506
Follow Up By: Allan B (Member, SunCoast) - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 10:50
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 10:50
Geez Bantam, you really have it in for high-visibility clothing don't you?
My wife was knitting you a
bright pink pullover for your birthday but I'll tell her not to bother now! LOL
And I won't even bother with the lighting issue!!!!
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Follow Up By: garrycol - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 11:15
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 11:15
I thought the thread was about DRLs not High Viz clothing. If someone is driving a vehicle with High Vis clothing it doesn't help other drivers see the vehicle.
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Follow Up By: MactrolPod - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 11:15
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 11:15
Fair go I'm struggling with Hi-Vis comment, I see a person in Hi-Vis
well before a non wearer when driving. Plus when we are working around machinery I feel better wearing it! You would have us wear camo gear!? Because I wear the stuff I might be more aware, I don't know.
The lights on during the day does appear to work for me but more of a curiosity, maybe that will wear off.
What bugs me is all the signs on the road, leave the road signs facing on coming traffic and all other signs removed or parallel to the road to reduce the clutter, its a nightmare. Miss a
sign and your speeding or in the wrong lane etc.
I'm from the country and hate driving in the city trying to keep an eye on everything, in saying that our town has advertising everywhere too.
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Follow Up By: The Bantam - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 11:43
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 11:43
daytime running lights and high vis clothing are one and the same issue in a differnt application.
I have no problem with the wearing of High Vis in situations where it is waranted and benificial, but expecting everybody to wear it all the time regardless of the actual risk, devalues it and makes it less effective.
I realy would like high vis to work for me when there is a real need and benifit.....but as it stands and as it is going high vis is just so common it just becomes part of the background of visual noise and people are taking less and less notice of it.
The same goes for use of lights during the day......I am perfectly happy to turn my headlights or
parking lights on where there is reduced visability...as required by law.....But it is my asertion that if every vehicle has daytime running lights on all the time the roads will just end up a sea of lights all day every day and the benifit will be lost.
If particular safety measure is effective in a particular situation it does not logically follow that it is benificial in all situations and should be used all the time.
If it was so we would have safety belts on arm chairs.
Back on the matter of visability.
Several seurveys and reseach has been done concering the relative safety benifits of cars painted certain colours.....it is clear and
well proven that cars painted certain colours are more inclined to not be seen and be involved in accidents......surely it would be far more effective to ban black or blue cars than to mandate daytime running lights.
Hell maybe we should all be driving pink or yellow cars with reflective stripes down the side.
But then the roads would be a mass of pink and yellow reflective cars and we would be back where we started.......having to look where we are going.
cheers
FollowupID:
819382
Follow Up By: Slow one - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 16:03
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 16:03
Garrycol,
No it is about safety gloves, safety boots, safety glasses and nannies. LOL.
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Follow Up By: Member - John - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 16:39
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 16:39
Too late, Vehicle Standard (Australian Design Rule 76/00 - Daytime Running Lamps) 2006, all new cars have to have them
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Follow Up By: AlanTH - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 17:04
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 17:04
When the EU dictators started pushing for vehicles to use headlights at all times, motorcycle organisations were dead against it because they again became invisible amongst a sea of lights especially in foul weather conditions.
I can see their point as a lot of motorists don't see them at all good weather or bad.
Problem is most of the road safety "experts" aren't drivers of anything except office seats....but they're the ones our pollies listen to.
AlanH.
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: olcoolone - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 17:36
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 17:36
AlanTH ..... there has been a lot of research over the last few years about what you are talking about..... the research showed for 80% of drivers headlights and hi vis gear worked and for the other 20% it made no difference, they put it down to the 20% who it made no difference to paid very little attention to there surrounding whilst driving.
The same argument has be raging for a few years about riding with correct bike gear like gloves and jackets...... you should read the letters of those against it and the talk of their rights; it's pathetic.
BTW since 2008/09 all new bike have had to have lights on from factory and it is defectable to bypass or alter the lights on.
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: AlanTH - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 17:52
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 17:52
I agree with bikes having lights on but in murky conditions I see their point that with all others using their lights (or those that care anyway) it does make them harder to spot.
I've always prided myself on being an aware driver and take extra care in those conditions but apart from bikes being harder to see, so also are the idiots who refuse to turn their lights on at all or just use sidelights which are next to useless.
Whilst driving a bus not long ago I nearly turned across the front of a vehicle without lights in real foul conditions......it was one of our
well trained WA traffic cops. Immediately after nearly being pranged he turned his lights on so he knew full
well the problem.
AlanTH.
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: olcoolone - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 18:49
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 18:49
I think the benefits of lights on in all conditions far out weighs the negatives, thats if there is any negatives........ Going by what others have said; does that mean at night or low light conditions people are going to see you better as all the other vehicles around you are driving with lights on and your will be the odd one out having no lights on?
Don't think so!
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Follow Up By: OutBack Wanderers - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 20:05
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 20:05
ADR 76/00 2006 might be on the books but not enforced, our new 2010 CRDI i30 does not have DRL and none of the other 100 vehicles we looked at before purchasing our car
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Reply By: Les PK Ranger - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 12:31
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 12:31
I feel (and do this myself always) driving with low beams on should be mandatory on highways when country driving.
You see a car approaching far better, and at much greater distance, than without lights on.
I think headlights at the normal height are better than DRLs as these are usually placed much lower and sometimes seen later than headlights.
Approaching (passing / overtaking) traffic and traffic turning out onto / off highways etc are the main situations that this would benefit.
In my opinion, there would be many less deaths each year if people used this common sense driving technique, far more lives would be saved as compared to most other GOVCO road safety focus.
Fatigue and inattention are the other issues that causes far more road deaths than say slight speed indiscretions when overtaking etc.
Driving with lights on around the suburbs is also highly recommended for the same reasons, but especially at dusk or in dismal weather.
AnswerID:
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Reply By: Sand Man (SA) - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 14:52
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 14:52
I believe daytime running lights are a bit of a wank, at least for country driving, and they would achieve nothing to improve visibility.
Headlights on during the day however, is an entirely different thing.
Consider this. You are sitting behind a slower moving truck or vehicle towing a caravan and wish to safely pass it.
If approaching vehicles have their headlights on, it is much easier to pick them out in the distance and assist you in deciding if you have time to pass.
Also, as you pull out and accelerate past the slower vehicle, it is much easier for oncoming traffic to see you, if you have your headlights on.
This was proven to me, time and time again on our recent trip to the
Kimberley.
"Daytime running lights", at least those poofy little rows of LED lights around the headlight glass, would give no such visibility assistance in this sort of case.
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Follow Up By: Slow one - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 15:59
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 15:59
Bill,
those poofy little lights actually give off much more visible light directed at the other vehicle than low beam headlights.
I believe country driving is where these lights will come into their own.
Buy yourself a copy of Powertorque and have a look for yourself.
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Follow Up By: cookie1 - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 19:51
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 19:51
Totally agree Sandman(SA), we had ours on the whole time the car was in motion, one of the benefits of the 200GX, the lights turn on & off with the ignition if you leave the lights turned on at the stalk.
Don't care about others opinions I found it much better when others approaching had theirs on.
cheers
FollowupID:
819427
Reply By: olcoolone - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 17:28
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 17:28
I think everyone should travel with there lights on during the day either headlights or DRL's.
Over the years as my eyesight naturally degrades cars that I use to see kilometres away seem to blend in with the surroundings.
The distance we can see vehicles with there lights on in day time compared with no lights is 10 fold and I think many accidents could be avoided it they were seen earlier.
I think it's a no brainer and why would you not want to be seen...... many who don't like things like this are the ones who think their rights are being eroded away and hate getting told what they should;d and shouldn't do.
Maybe if they looked when travelling and noted the difference in viability and distance they can see other vehicles with lights on and lights off they might have a different view of the situation.
All new motorbikes since 2008/09 have had lights you can not turn off....... like the car people there was a big outcry of rights by motorbikes to a point there was protests where people rode with their lights blanked out with cardboard...... yes brain dead!
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Follow Up By: Shaker - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 17:31
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 17:31
Fair go, next thing you'll be expecting drivers to use indicators!
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Follow Up By: Bigfish - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 19:38
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 19:38
Alright Shaker...I'll bite....what's an indicator??.......lol
I,m sure there are many road users who are afraid to use them!!!!at least it seems like that at times
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Follow Up By: Slow one - Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 20:06
Sunday, Jul 06, 2014 at 20:06
Olcoolone, I would thank you with the button but that isn't working for me. So here is a written thanks.
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Follow Up By: Echucan Bob - Monday, Jul 07, 2014 at 00:01
Monday, Jul 07, 2014 at 00:01
Totally agree OCO. I just wish oncoming police cars also had a clearly visible means of identification so you could slow down appropriately and avoid contributing to the state coffers.
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Reply By: Member - Laurie K (WA) - Thursday, Jul 10, 2014 at 22:01
Thursday, Jul 10, 2014 at 22:01
I am a big advocate for full time headlights. I have mine wired to the ignition (after many bush walks and returning to a dead battery). It's a case of self preservation. You can be bloody minded and refuse to accept that there ARE people driving whose eyesight whilst legally 20/20, with advancing age are finding some problems with contrast and definition, but if I can alert someone else to the fact that I am potentially in their line of travel due to them misjudging or not seeing me until it is too late, then it has been a worthwhile exercise.
I recently had a car following me for many kms, who had plenty of opportunities to overtake, before they finally pulled out and nearly collected an oncoming vehicle (who DIDN'T have headlights on). It could have been you ………
I notice that there are now more signs
on the road suggesting you turn on your lights "and be seen".
I also find that you can see headlights through the bush on winding roads before you see the vehicle (who is usually travelling at breakneck speed for the conditions).
YOU might think you have great eyesight, but do you? Our hearing deteriorates over time, and it's only when someone asks why the volume is turned up so loud that we start to consider that maybe all is not what it once was. The same with eyesight.
Put the ego away, don't be bloody minded …… Turn on ya lights ……. :-)
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