disposable diesel jerries

Submitted: Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 11:25
ThreadID: 117782 Views:2658 Replies:20 FollowUps:26
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This may seem odd, but will free up space when travelling
Consider the following scenario.
Planning long trip, and fuel tank plus longranger tank is sufficient to take you between fuel stops on all legs except one leg. For that one leg you need to take a jerry but space is at a premium. You will use it once only but have to carry that empty jerry (that occupies valuable space) for thousands of km after one use.

So the question is, are there cheaper jerries or containers that one can use?
What about plastic water type containers? I know that the proper plastic jerries are made off a special plastic, (not sure if it is not to react with diesel or if it is not to react wiith UV) but will it be ok for a single use say wiithin one week of filling it?

Cheers CJ
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Reply By: Member - gujimbo - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 11:57

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 11:57
Hi

get yourself some proper diesel bladder containers, when empty they pack flat, very common with the boat industry.

Cheers
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Reply By: The Explorer - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 12:04

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 12:04
Hi

I have used old oil drums before..



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Follow Up By: wholehog - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 20:03

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 20:03
Did you take them home or proper dispose..?
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Reply By: muzbry - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 12:08

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 12:08
Gday
Go to your local earth mover and get a 20 ltr plastic oil drum. after emptying, just put on your evening fire. Dont forget to take the residue of the drum with you next morning.
AnswerID: 553474

Follow Up By: vk1dx - Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 07:20

Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 07:20
Not the best idea that you have had, Muz. Burning plastic to dispose of it is not very welcome my friend. Maybe some other way?
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Reply By: TomH - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 12:17

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 12:17
Why would you have to carry it for thousands of K. If it is your last remaining fuel to get to next pump it would seem logical to leave it there and ask the guy if he can give it to someone else to use.

Also why not fill the tank out of it after the start of the trip, when tank has used more than 20L and burn it the next campfire. Then you dont have to carry it for more than a day

Its only $19 for a 20L plastic one now so use it and chuck it.

Can sell you 2 for $25 ATM
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Follow Up By: TomH - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 12:19

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 12:19
Edit meant on the day of the long leg.
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Follow Up By: Member - mike g2 - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 20:41

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 20:41
Hi all, nice idea, haven't heard that anyone can build one yet that suffices both fuel carrying role and environmentally safe disposability. there working on this problem with plastic shopping bags that decay after time.
not so sure if its a good idea to burn the plastic as a disposal option- off road etiquette suggests what comes in goes out and again- leave only footprints. ideally, bring any "rubbish" back for correct disposal.
I am sure I read recently there's piles of MT drums out on canning stock route from refuelling practices.
bladders sound like good idea.
MG.
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Follow Up By: vk1dx - Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 07:23

Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 07:23
Not you best idea either Tom, my friend. See my post above.
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Reply By: AlbyNSW - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 12:26

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 12:26
I was told by a plastics manufacturer that the diesel plastic is denser than the water container plastic as the diesel slowly leaches through it
I believe you can use them but will eventually feel greasy on the outside
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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 22:39

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 22:39
Hi Alby, All fuel and water containers are(HDPE) High Density Polyethylene. They are different colours for identification purposes. HDPE is easy to blow mould and good chemical and impact strength. regards Michael
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Follow Up By: AlbyNSW - Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 07:35

Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 07:35
That is true Micheal but there are different grades and densities of the product which is why the identical tank they sell for diesel is dearer
Colour is for identification only
I was advised this direct from the manufacturer of blow mould diesel and water tanks
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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 08:22

Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 08:22
Ably! I've been in the plastics industry for 42 years, even worked at WillowWare in Tullamarine where they make them. There is nothing special about the base material. Michael
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Reply By: Hoyks - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 15:02

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 15:02
I have mates that go on long rides in the desert on motor bikes. Some take a fuel bladder that can be rolled up once empty, another popular (cheap) way to get a few more km is to scrounge up a few 5L oil containers. They can be found easily enough, are oil resistant by design and generally are over engineered for the task. 2L coke bottles and 2L wine casks (goon bags) have also been pressed into service.

As said above, a 5, 10 or 20L plastic or steel oil drums will work. Square shapes are easier to pack than a traditional round drum and a plastic one is less likely to damage your other stuff. They also tend to dent, rather than get punctured and split. Smaller containers also mean that you lose less if one springs a leak.
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Reply By: Sand Man (SA) - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 15:47

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 15:47
Sounds like a silly idea to me.
One jerry is 20 litres and the need for that extra amount "for one leg" just doesn't compute.

When you look at how much space a couple of Jerry Cans take up, I don't think the space could be classed as all that "valuable" for other uses.
I consider a couple of Jerrycans of diesel as part of careful planning on longer trips between fuel stops.
I don't need longranger fuel tanks for the type of remote traveling I do, but choose a couple of full jerrycans of diesel as a good insurance policy when traveling. I have come across situations where I have been a little short on fuel capacity requirements and an extra half a tank I get from 2 jerries, gets me to my ultimate destination for that leg, without any dramas. It gives me an extra 400-450 km distance.
There may be times when fuel consumption calculations go out the window due to strong head winds, or adverse track conditions.
I don't like the feeling of "will I make it or not" and the potential of sucking up some contamination from the dregs of the fuel tank.

To me, a couple of tanks of fuel are mandatory and I will leave something else home to make way for them if necessary. That of course is extremely unlikely, as I carry the jerrycans in a cradle on the draw bar of my camper.
What else could fit in their place?
A generator in a box?
Nah, we won't go there!

Bill


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Follow Up By: CSeaJay - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 21:48

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 21:48
Bill you know nothing of our situation, our car and how big our family is, what would you 'consider in your wisdom' what valuable space is? Soo off topic and so not helpful,
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Follow Up By: Sand Man (SA) - Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 08:34

Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 08:34
Flame me all you like CJ,

What I am alluding to, is that next to water, an adequate fuel supply is arguably the next highest requirement for remote travel.
To attempt to save room by not carrying these adequate supplies, you may be relying on other travelers to get you out of the bleep e.

As for bladders, which you have pointed out below may be the answer to your problem, just realize that these will take up as much, or even more of your valuable space, even for that one leg.
You need to ensure it is in a place that protects it from puncturing and after you have emptied it, a place still, to store it.

Jerrycans (I use steel ones) take up surprisingly little space in my opinion and are the safest way to carry extra fuel.

So, I don't really care about your situation, or what you carry on your escapades.
I have offered my input and you can consider it, or ignore it.



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Follow Up By: CSeaJay - Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 09:25

Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 09:25
Bill

You are just, in your considered wisdom, assuming that I do not plan. That I do not have another backup, and that I have an empty car with oodles of space. And that I am travelling remote. Whereas all I am Planning for is to use that space more wisely on legs that I already have sufficient backup for.
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Reply By: Jackolux - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 17:03

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 17:03
You find room at the start for a full jerrycans but when you tip that into the tank , what has actually jumped into that space when you were tipping it in .
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Follow Up By: Fab72 - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 17:25

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 17:25
Tea spoons, tea towels, novelty snow domes and stubbie holders.

I'm with you Jack..... I usually gain space towards the end of my travels, not lose it.

Fab.
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Follow Up By: Sand Man (SA) - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 17:55

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 17:55
Not necessarily Jackolux,

My jerrycans stay in their racks and I use a Tanami Pump to transfer the fuel to my tank.
Easy as!
Bill


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Follow Up By: Jackolux - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 19:49

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 19:49
That's the go Bill if ya don't take ya Jerry Cans out , nothing can sneak into their spot while ya not lookin .
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Follow Up By: wholehog - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 20:07

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 20:07
Well said, and its like the disposable rubbish we see outback, beaches etc...people take their stuff/food/fuel/resources/tissues in containers and use the contents, then don't have the intelligence to take the empty container home..almost weightless, yet the dimension of the product and the mass wasn't a problem to take out to the boonies..xxxx-xxx lazy clowns.
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Reply By: Bigfish - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 17:09

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 17:09
Just buy a diesel suitable bladder...simple as.
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Follow Up By: Sand Man (SA) - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 17:56

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 17:56
And where do you store the bladder when it is full???

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Follow Up By: Bigfish - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 18:23

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 18:23
SANDMAN.

He can store the filled bladder where ever he wants. His concern was with an empty container.....
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Follow Up By: wholehog - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 20:10

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 20:10
Wasn't it full when he went out there..??..and he has since used fuel, food, water and xxxx paper...WTF is the problem bring the empties back..?
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Reply By: Member - Sanantone - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 17:58

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 17:58
Currently I have two 20 lt steel jerry cans with me, I think now I would have been better with 4 x 10 lt plastic cans, to distribute the weight better, and much easier to tip into car, I also think you never know when you may need extra fuel, so I would find space for some, remember what you leave behind to fit them, wasn't really needed anyway:)
Tony
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Reply By: Iza B - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 18:10

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 18:10
3 litre milk containers are HDPE. I have seen diesel carried in them in a one use situation as you describe.

Iza
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Reply By: wholehog - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 20:08

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 20:08
CSeaJay...HTFU and go buy some diesel fuel suitable jerries, and bring the bastards back.
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Reply By: Dion - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 20:17

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 20:17
10L boxed water bladders. Even the Black and Gold brand are near on indestructable. Buy a couple, or three, you could buy three for <$15. Use the water, when empty, pull the cap off and let air out. When dry inside, fill with diesel and cap. You can always put the bladder back in the box which affords a bit more protection. Diesel will actually last quite a while in these bladders. When you use it, the bladder takes up less space than a pack of cards, even less if you can induce a significant chemical change after use.
After one trip using fixed water containers, I've then always used boxed water. It's cheap, the cardboard can be burned, and the bladder, well see above. Although the bladder holds 10L of water, in reality the outside dimensions of the box is 11L in volume, so when used, you then obtain 11L in volume of space.
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Follow Up By: Motherhen - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 23:17

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 23:17
Is it illegal to carry fuel in a container not designed for fuel carrying such as these water cannisters?

I know petrol will dissolve some plastics, but I have not tested diesel. We purchase diesel jerry cans for around $20 on special from Supercheap. Once empty they could be carried on a roof rack, or as suggested above in spare tyre rubbish bags at the rear of your vehicle. If you have a trailer CJ, they could be carried on the a-frame.

Our son purchased expensive fuel bladders for petrol when he motorcycled the Canning Stock Route.

How remote are you travelling that you will not be able to purchase fuel when needed?

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Reply By: Member - Phil G (SA) - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 21:26

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 21:26
If you can carry them in.....then you can carry them out
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Reply By: CSeaJay - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 21:46

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 21:46
Thanks guys for several good ideas
I did not know of bladders and that sounds like the solution for us.
Notwithstanding some replies implying that one leaves rubbish, that is just, rubbish.
Anyway thank you
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Follow Up By: Jackolux - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 22:11

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 22:11
Hey CJ , I'm just a little curious , how come you can find room for a full can of fuel but when it's M/T you need to dump it , what changes , that you need that space for something else , do you collect rocks or what
Just wondering that's all .
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Follow Up By: CSeaJay - Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 09:28

Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 09:28
Jackolux

I just have a full car thats all. Family of four, food, drink and water for extended trips. Even If i can free up some space for more legroom for the kids on 9/10ths of the journey it will be worth it. The space that that extra jerry takes can be used to give them more elbow space. And the other consideration is that there is literally only one leg that I need this extra backup for.
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Reply By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 22:56

Saturday, May 09, 2015 at 22:56
I understand your problem exactly! Robin Miller on this site, packs two full plastic jerries in his Patrol and when he has consumed 40 litres of fuel he pours the fuel into the Patrols tank and puts the empty jerries into a purpose made bag, im not sure if vinyl or a fabric, this hangs of the spare wheel just like the rubbish bags you can buy! Michael
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Reply By: vk1dx - Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 07:30

Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 07:30
I know that technically this is off topic (in full so that mods will see it and decide).

I do not believe that burning is a responsible and environmentally responsible way to dispose of plastic. Unfortunately some still toss all this type of stuff in the fire.

Please don't do it.

If you agree then please just tick the Thank you. Lets not start another topic.

Csejay has a legitimate question and deserves a responsible answer.

We purchased a long range tank so that we would not run short. So far including the CSR all has been well. No need for jerry cans. In fact the jerry can holder is being removed from the car before our Madigan trip. It is obsolete and not needed.
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Follow Up By: CSeaJay - Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 09:30

Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 09:30
I do not propose nor have I implied that I will do this . And I agree with your comments.
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Follow Up By: vk1dx - Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 09:38

Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 09:38
Rest easy mate. No one said that you did.
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Follow Up By: get outmore - Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 10:05

Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 10:05
throwing stuff in the fire can well serve a purpose
not sure id throw plastic on the fire due to the smell bit it would greatly reduce in size,
i went out with some people and they threw all thier food tins in the fire - i gently reminded them tin doesnt burn - but that wasnt the aim
they fished them out the next morning to cool while having breakfast - they were then stashed in the rubish bag and didnt stink or attract ants for the trip
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Follow Up By: Member - John (Vic) - Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 14:28

Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 14:28
I have always burnt out steel cans for that very reason Dave.
Easy as to fish them out, crush them and whack them in the non burn rubbish bag with the crushed non burnt ally cans and bottles.

I use two rubbish bags on the wheel carrier, the burn bag in which we put burnable stuff such as paper, cardboard etc and dispose of it in a suitable camp fire or a suitable disposal facility which ever comes first.
The other as I said is the non burn which we carry until we reach suitable proper disposal facilities.

The old story, you carry it in, you can carry it out, a crushed empty can weighs nothing and is a tenth the original size, easy as!

We don't bury our toilet paper either, we put used toilet paper into a brown paper bag and put it in the burn bag.
The only thing buried is the number two's.

A simple system overall that deals well with our rubbish and waste.

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Reply By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 08:14

Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 08:14
The problem CSeaJay has is that like most people when they leave home, their vehicle is chokablock. So packing and unpacking would be a little easier once the jerries are removed from the inside of the vehicle and getting to things you need is easier. Nothing worse than having things you can't use, cluttering an already tight space. I thought it would have been obvious what the problem was. I had thought of making a light frame between my RRT and the wind deflector for that purpose, when the two jerries are empty, stick them on the roof out of the way. It would be good for the Simpson and trip legs where you just need that safety net if conditions are that you use more fuel than intended and a possibility you may run out of fuel. I think the question was a reasonable one and far more sensible than some of the crap that is posted here! Michael
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Reply By: The Landy - Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 11:41

Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 11:41
In part this issue has its genesis in wanting vehicles that suit all requirements, both for day to day travel and for longer range touring.

The reality is that most vehicles have a reasonable amount of space, but that is to allow different configurations rather than the ability to fill every space with pieces of equipment and supplies. Once you put a family of up to five into it the ability to carry sufficient fuel decreases rapidly.

In these cases it almost comes down to modifying your plans to fit the range the vehicle has with the fuel you "can" comfortably carry, take a trailer, or reassess the choice of vehicle.

When I plan for a rip I work out the essentials of what I need to take, the number of people in the vehicle, and back solve for the fuel I can then carry to remain within the vehicle design, axle and GVM limitations. That in turn will dictate the route you can take based on were you can obtain fuel...

I am thinking that if one 20-litre jerry can is critical to comfort than perhaps there is too much already loaded in the vehicle.

But either way, good luck with your deliberations, perhaps once you have used the gerry can you can give it to another traveller along the way - a small expense for the comfort...

Cheers, Baz - The Landy
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Follow Up By: The Landy - Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 11:42

Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 11:42
Edit: "When I plans for a trip (not rip!)".

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Reply By: Bob Y. - Qld - Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 13:30

Sunday, May 10, 2015 at 13:30
My thoughts are that you require containers that are compact and robust, CSeaJay?

Using anything other than specific fuel containers puts you at risk of having a diesel leak in your vehicle......kids won't be happy and the Cook will be really p!ss5d!!! Why not take 2-4 x 10L jerrycans, and these can be packed amongst all your other stuff. Or you can tie them up on the roof rack, out of the way, and offering little wind resistance.

May I ask where this "leg" is that requires more than your 2 tanks of fuel? Buying a fuel container just prior to the long leg would reduce space issues for you.

Hope you get something sorted and have an enjoyable trip.

Bob

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