Remote travel dilemma’s

Submitted: Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 11:05
ThreadID: 137489 Views:3390 Replies:17 FollowUps:57
Hi all
Just some thoughts on the subject of people coming unstuck anywhere.
After reading threads such as “ unbelievable — another desert rescue” and other stories in all media’s.

Today’s vehicles, 4x4 and motorcycle’s etc. are so good inexperienced operator’s can go nearly anywhere.

Equipment, fridges , tents , the lot are so good these days, makes it easy too.

GPS navigation and emergency equipment as well ( which ever you choose) can maybe give a false sense of security.

Such good gear encourages more people to get out there.
Media of all sorts, tv , magazines, forums , Facebook etc. also is encouraging people to get out there.
But even with great equipment sometimes, people are going to make mistakes.

Education is my answer to reducing problems. (Not regulation)But Whatever, nothing is going to stop all incidents unfortunately.
You could regulate, (more nanny state stuff) but that’ doesn’t stop people doing stuff! Does every boaty do everything to regulation? Does everyone totally stick to road rules?
Most people keep learning all their life. I’ve been motorcycling /4x4ing for most of my life and consider myself fairly experienced, but still learn new techniques.
This forum is a great place for information and advice. Inexperienced people are looking for info and advice.
But I wish posters would think a bit before making some of the inappropriate comments, try to be helpful instead of derogatory. Don’t presume anything when seeing a report on the media. We don’t know we weren’t there.
Let’s all try to be helpful.
Happy safe travels
Shane

Back Reply Expand Un-Read 18 Moderator

Reply By: Crusier 91 - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 11:47

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 11:47
As I'm growing older I tend to steer further away from mainstream thinking, viewing things differently.
The beauty about being human is we do make mistakes will continue to make mistakes it's how one learns which is also a form of education
So if it was not for the past and recent incidents perhaps there would be more fatalities.
AnswerID: 622272

Reply By: HKB Electronics - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 12:00

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 12:00
Education is good, when I purchased my 4X4 first thing I did was a 4X4 drivers education course.

Second thing is no your limitations, if your not comfortable doing something don't do it! If possible watch others that know what their doing and if they for instance do a water crossing ok then ask for advice. Don't blindly follow a think because they made it you will too as you don't know what equipment they may have that has enabled them to get them through. Most are happy to help you out if your not sure.

Navigation, we did not go bush until we knew how to use our navigation gear, we also carry four systems for redundancy, one in car unit, main navigation system. A tablet with ozi, and phone with ozi and a hand held GPS. We come across people at times who don't know what track their on or what direction they are heading!

I'll prepared vehicles, and the occasional very well prepared vehicle but the people driving it have absolutely no mechanical knowledge. On a trip down the Anne Beadell a few years back there was a car with a broken leaf spring and the owner had no idea how to get the car going again. Most don't even know how to remove an air filter to clean it.

On a recent trip we were asked to pass a message onto a car that had broken down up the track, that a recovery had been arranged and to sit put. When we got there we found two 4X4 with heaps of advertising over them and the broken down Nissan sitting on the side of the road, car looked fine didn't ask what was wrong with it but it looked towable. My thoughts were though got all the slick gear, adds all over the car but no sat phone?
HKB Electronics

Business Member
My Profile  Send Message

AnswerID: 622273

Follow Up By: IvanTheTerrible - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 12:15

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 12:15
When I was first given a bike I started small with little trials and worked my way up. Did the same with 4x4. Started off with basic 4 wheel driving transitioning to sand and mud then some basic outback and so on. But I will never assume to know everything and shit can and does happen. When it does it's hard to be taught how to deal with the unexpected and near impossible to teach common sense.
2
FollowupID: 895070

Follow Up By: KevinE - Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 19:12

Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 19:12
I've been doing the outback thing for 45 or so years. I'm an old dog & it's hard for me to learn new tricks, so I've stuck with what I know & what has served me well. Paper maps.

I don't own any of the gizmo's or gadgets that so many seem to think are a must have.

I had never even contemplated using GPS until my last trip.

But I recently discovered a cracker of a use for GPS!

Even though we've traveled outback together for decades & have never been "lost" My wife tends to panic about us being lost when we get a bit remote.

So, we're traveling along again & my soulmate started to panic, as usual & I had a light globe moment!

"Have a look at the GPS on your phone" I said, she did & BINGO! We were right where we should have been. It saved me a massive amount of grief!

I'm now a huge GPS fan!

Now, I'll probably get bitten by a bloody snake & have no sat phone lol!

3
FollowupID: 895120

Reply By: Peter_n_Margaret - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 13:51

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 13:51
On the 7th of December 1998 tourist Caroline Grossmueller perished near Lake Eyre. As a result of that death, all hire 4WD campers are now required to have PLBs.
I suggest that has prevented several deaths since that time.
It is a simple and low cost solution to preventing these type of deaths, irrespective of what the root cause was and irrespective of education or stupidity.
Cheers,
Peter
OKA196 motorhome
AnswerID: 622274

Follow Up By: 9900Eagle - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 17:38

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 17:38
Peter, I agree with your post as it is proven that these items have saved many land and sea travellers over the years.

I just don't know how you get the message through to the masses. To me it seems pretty simple when you go somewhere. Tell others where you are going, carry water, stay with the vehicle and hopefully you carry a plb. Then again I definitely am not a rocket scientist
I have travelled many K's and that goes into the millions when driving long haul and doing some pretty remote jobs, someone always knew where I going was and approximately when I should be there, give or take a few days.

I think this story says it all. local copper talked him into carrying it.

Link
1
FollowupID: 895073

Follow Up By: rumpig - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 18:34

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 18:34
Correct me if i'm wrong please....but from memory of the coroners inquest, wasn't there a person working at the William Creek Hotel that wrote the overseas couples details down and the day and time expected back from Halligan Bay, but never followed up on the fact the couple hadn't returned from there?
Whilst they didn't have a PLB (did anyone or many people at all back then?), i think the report said that overseas couple did leave the details of where they were going and when to expect them back with someone, in the belief that was the safe back up plan they needed to visit where they were going....sadly there was a breakdown in their system at the hotel, and the fact the couple hadn't returned by thier scheduled day and time was missed and the rest is a sad history. It's easy to bag out those people as a stupid clueless overseas couple, but they took preventative steps they believed would save them if they ran into trouble just like they did, but unfortunately for them, someone else failed to do the job they were supposed to do that would have saved them.
1
FollowupID: 895075

Follow Up By: Peter_n_Margaret - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 19:27

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 19:27
Travellers wrote their own names and plans in the book.
Yes, there was a problem with the checks and follow-up at William Creek, but I suggest that was inevitable, eventually, as tourist numbers increased dramatically.

We were carrying an EPIRB at that time. We could not afford a sat 'phone. We now carry a 'sat phone and a PLB. Relying on others for your absolute safety is not a good plan.
Cheers,
Peter
OKA196 motorhome
3
FollowupID: 895077

Follow Up By: Greg J1 - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 20:20

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 20:20
Everybody should live by Peter’s last sentence. I can’t be bothered to quote it. Just read it.

Cheers Greg.

4
FollowupID: 895079

Follow Up By: rumpig - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 07:37

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 07:37
@Peter....Pretty sure the person behind the bar wrote thier names or atleast got them to write thier details in a new book, because they couldn’t find the old one they normally use...they then got busy in the coming days at the hotel with a load of tourists staying there after thier vehicle broke down and completely forgot about checking the book, it was something the dad normally did and he was away I think from memory. Regardless of who wrote the names in the book, the tourists took the steps they thought should save them if they did get into trouble out there....hindsight for them was a sad situation though.
0
FollowupID: 895089

Follow Up By: Rangiephil - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 09:08

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 09:08
My understanding is that the cause of her death was that she tried to walk out to William Creek and they were there in December when the temperature would have been 45C at least. The date is on the plaque.
Her companion did the right thing and stayed with the car.
The Police locked the front hubs and drove the car out of the bog.
Her companion survived.
Poor training on the vehicle and leaving the vehicle were the reasons for her death.
1
FollowupID: 895091

Follow Up By: Peter_n_Margaret - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 10:37

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 10:37
Correct.
Completely avoidable if they had a PLB.
We were there in May 1999.

It was quite chilling. The remains of the medical examination gloves were still on the ground.
We had an EPIRB, but no 2 way long range communications, but were travelling with another vehicle.
Something I have never forgotten.
Cheers,
Peter
OKA196 motorhome
1
FollowupID: 895093

Follow Up By: rumpig - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 12:55

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 12:55
Reads much as I recalled, with the person at the hotel informing the couple they’d come look for them if they didn’t return.....the Police fairly easily extracted the bogged vehicle, but it wasn’t just locking the front hubs in as stated above.
http://www.lakeeyreyc.com/coroner.html
2
FollowupID: 895096

Follow Up By: garrycol - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 13:48

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 13:48
So as usual the story morfed to locked the hubs and just drove out when the hubs were already locked and the vehicle was X axled. Even the police could not drive the vehicle out until more sand was removed from under the vehicle and the tyres let down further.

The tourist had an idea what to do but lack of experience meant he did not do enough. Likewise the same applies to the woman - ok she should have stayed with the vehicle and didn't, but she was still found with a bit of water on her - she probably walked during the heat of the day and suffered hyperthermia even drinking water, but not enough.

A sad event all round.
0
FollowupID: 895097

Follow Up By: Alloy c/t - Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 12:01

Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 12:01
Of course 'completely avoidable if they had a PLB' .... yep as sad as it is ....how different would Australia be if Bourke and Wills had a PLB or Lassiter had GPS available or instead of 'Sail' Captn Cook had a diesel engined ship with a depth sounder showing exactly the depth of the reef at 'Cooktown' .... how completely avoidable would the 'rescue' of the family stuck in the Simpson in September had been IF after the 1st cough from the engine they turned back instead of continuing ? .....Think I'l have to strap the Sat phone and PBL , 2 of each to allow for redundancy , onto my 20 lt water carry back pack when I leave camp to go the 20 mt away to dig the hole and burn the toilet paper .....
0
FollowupID: 895115

Follow Up By: Idler Chris - Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 17:35

Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 17:35
Well Alloy c/t, if a snake bites you while you are on the crapper you should live to tell us all about it. I hope it does not happen though.
Chris
What other people think of me is none of my business.
Do unto others what you would have them do unto you.

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

1
FollowupID: 895116

Follow Up By: Alloy c/t - Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 17:53

Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 17:53
Don't be bloody silly Idler Chris , no snake will come near me as I will also have my solar powered Sonic snake repellant stake - light with me .[ saw it advertised on TV ] can't be too careful after all , the point being where does all this 'necessary' equipment / spare parts carrying etc etc stop......
3
FollowupID: 895117

Follow Up By: Michael H9 - Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 18:58

Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 18:58
Personally, I'm a very firm believer in Murphy's Law when packing for a trip. Step 1, I'll always forget to pack something. Step 2, whatever I forgot is what I desperately need.
2
FollowupID: 895119

Reply By: Frank P (NSW) - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 18:36

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 18:36
"Education is my answer to reducing problems. (Not regulation) But Whatever, nothing is going to stop all incidents unfortunately."

I think you've hit the nail on the head, Shane r1.

There is so much marketing of 4WDs and "Off Road" campers and vans and "touring the Outback" that I think the average suburban Jo-blow is tempted to think he can just buy all the gear, load the wife and kids and head off into the wild red yonder.

How do you counteract that and convince people that "they don't know what they don't know" and to seek advice.

May be from time to time, and especially before holiday and travel seasons, there should be community service announcements in the media - radio, TV and print - paid for by the various governments, state and federal and advising would-be Outback travellers of things to consider and why.

Perhaps there could be a one-page pamphlet included in every annual rego renewal for car, van and trailer.

Perhaps a similar pamphlet or brochure should be part of the advertising and/or sale of every 4WD, camper and van.

Such measures may end up cheaper in the long-run for the authorities than multiple searches and if they save some lives then they will have been worth the expense.
AnswerID: 622275

Follow Up By: Member - shane r1 - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 20:35

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 20:35
Great idea about pamphlets in regos or part of buying gear (but that would only cover new).
And still some wouldn’t get read or heeded.
0
FollowupID: 895080

Reply By: Member - Stephen L (Clare SA) - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 19:37

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 19:37
Hi Shane

We can all try our best, but there is one item that no one else has mentioned yet.

Yes we carry a PLB, Satellite Phone, HF Radio, signal mirror signal beacon for use at night, which all require either Fiona or I to activate or use.

All the above are a very good piece of mind, but what happens if we are involved in a vehicle accident?

For this and other uses, we also use a SPOT.

Some people complain about their yearly cost, but again it is a small price to pay for our safety.

My SPOTWALLA details are given to family and friends, where they track our travels within 5 minutes of real time travel. In the event of an accident, the SPOT will show our exact position and also showed that we have not moved. This would then be enough for my family to call authorities and give them our exact location, without guessing where we could be..

The sad part of life is that we will not stop fool hearted and unprepared people from getting into life threatening situation and possible loss of life.

This will not be the last time that we hear of such situations here on the EO forum.


Cheers



Stephen
Roxby Downs Special

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

AnswerID: 622276

Follow Up By: Member - shane r1 - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 20:48

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 20:48
Thanks Stephen
Yes I didn’t mention I use a spot , especially when on my motorcycle, and more so when I’m travelling alone , but pretty much all the time including when we are remote in the 4x4. We also carry a sat phone. Partly thanks to information you put on this site.
Do I remember correctly there was a time when you were one that wasn’t a fan of the spot?
The inreach is also a great idea , doing similar tracking as the spot , but also allowing text messaging
Cheers
1
FollowupID: 895081

Follow Up By: Member - Stephen L (Clare SA) - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 21:04

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 21:04
Hi Shane

Yes I have to admit that it did take some arm twisting for me to change my mind thanks to a fellow EO member, that travels away each year for around 6 months (you lucky bugger Chris).

Each year he includes me in his friends list and each day I follow his progress and it played dividends 2 years ago when he was stranded at Neales Breakaway due to rain for 3 days. His SPOT showed he had not moved and we then kept in contact via his Satphone with daily weather updates.

My dad follows my progress all the time with my SPOT and he can see where we stop for every lunch stop, something that my PLB can not do, not unless activated in an emergency.


Cheers


Stephen

Roxby Downs Special

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

1
FollowupID: 895082

Reply By: KiwiAngler - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 21:06

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 21:06
I've been a full time traveller fir more than 9 years now and have had my SPOT tracker on every day during this time.i travel alone and a lot of it is remote travel.
Having travelled more than 350,000 kilometers in that time.
I have my SPOT tracking page details showing as part of my signature, in all my posts ( including here), my emails and any other web spaces.
Over the 9 years over 36,000 people have viewed my page.
I also have UHF, HF, 3 PLB's, satt phone, 4g phone and an emergency "grab bag" with numerous safety equipment inside.
Hopefully none if these will ever be used in "anger" but if such a situation arises then I know i will be glad I've got them.

https://spotwalla.com/tripViewer.php?id=2d464de362759825a

Follow me via SPOT:

https://spotwalla.com/tripViewer.php?id=2d464de362759825a

Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

AnswerID: 622280

Follow Up By: Idler Chris - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 22:21

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 22:21
Hi KiwiAngler,
You have certainly got all bases covered. I only have 2 PLB's, no HF, and the grab bag is on the to do list.
Well done.
What other people think of me is none of my business.
Do unto others what you would have them do unto you.

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 895083

Reply By: Idler Chris - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 22:05

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 22:05
I very much agree with Stephen. He and I do exactly the same thing and send tracking details to each other as well as our family and friends. Having an experienced outback traveller following your travels adds to your safety as they have a better idea of what maybe abnormal.

A SPOT device is the ultimate in your personal safety if you travel as a single vehicle. A SPOT device is portable and for your own safety you should carry it should you leave the vehicle. Great for bushwalking and exploring. A SPOT device is sending via satellite your position every 5 minutes. Should you have an emergency and you are able push the SOS button, help will be on its way to your exact location within a matter of minutes. If you are unable to push the SOS button, help will be on the way when those monitoring your travels notice you have not moved and raise the alarm. Help will come in the quickest possible time as it is known exactly where you are.

I do not know about others, but the cost of a SPOT device and its annual monitoring subscription is insignificant compared with the value I place on my life. Additionally, should a rescue take place, your position is exactly known so no search party is required. This is a great saving to the community and it also does not put at risk the life of any potential rescuer.

EOTrackMe is good at tracking but it depends on you device as to how good it is. If you link it to a SPOT device (as I do) it is updated every 5 minutes. However if it is linked to a computer or telephone which relies on mobile phone reception, then it is of little use in the more remote parts of Australia where there is no reception.

Mobile phones and PLB's are good but they rely on you physically being able to activate them. If your emergency situation renders you unable to activate a PLB or use a sat phone then no one knows you have had an emergency situation or where you are.

In the case of snakebite, heart attack, and stroke your best chance of recovery is to be immobilised immediately. I would argue that a SPOT device in these situations is your best chance of surviving.

Shane does make one point that is very true. That is by having a SPOT device you may venture to places that you otherwise might not go to for safety reasons. I know I do this, but it just means it may take a little bit longer to reach me in an emergency. I decide what risks I take, but should the worst come to the worst I have not caused a search and rescue mission to find me which possibly endangers the lives of others.

Finally, it can give peace of mind to loved ones at home knowing they can see exactly where you are at anytime of the day. Because I travel for 4 to 5 months every year, some of which is very remote, and some of which could be by myself, I know my family find it quite reassuring. Additional it is quite educational for my grandkids as they follow my travels and google many of the places I go to. It is great to ring them when ever I get mobile coverage and they can usually tell me where I am and maybe even something about where I am.

A SPOT device is a lot like Maxtraks, you hope you very use them, but if you do you say it is the best money ever spent.
What other people think of me is none of my business.
Do unto others what you would have them do unto you.

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

AnswerID: 622281

Follow Up By: Idler Chris - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 22:36

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 22:36
Another point worth noting.
With a PLB you register it with the Australian Maritime Safety Authority. During the registration process you give details about yourself, your emergency contacts, where you are travelling, and any other relevant information. You can update this information at any time and particularly just before you start a trip. It is a very good idea to include the URL reference of your SPOT tracker. If the Australian Maritime Safety Authority get an alert from your PLB and/or your SPOT tracker, they have to go through some verification processes to ensure that it is in fact a real emergency. The more information they have of you and your whereabouts the quicker help is likely to arrive. As one can imagine that if the Australian Maritime Safety Authority received emergency signals from both your PLB and SPOT devices which would give the same location, they could immediately rule out that a device has been set off in error, so saving some time.
Chris
What other people think of me is none of my business.
Do unto others what you would have them do unto you.

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

2
FollowupID: 895084

Follow Up By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 23:03

Sunday, Nov 25, 2018 at 23:03
.
So Chris, would you explain the benefit of multiple PLB's.
Cheers
Allan

Member
My Profile  My Blog  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 895085

Follow Up By: Idler Chris - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 00:05

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 00:05
Allan, I have two because in one the battery is out of date and has been for three years but it still tests OK. I can only presume the one with the battery out of date would not transmit for as long. When I had only one PLB I would keep it in the car during the day and in the camper at night, as you never know when you will need it. On a number of occasions I left it in the closed up camper by mistake, which sort of defeats the purpose of having it. I now keep the out date battery one in the camper and the in date one in the car. Given my advancing years I think it is prudent to have either a SPOT or PLB within reach at all times. When the PLB with the out of date battery fails its monthly test I will be seriously thinking of getting its battery replaced so that it is much easier to always have help at hand.
Chris
What other people think of me is none of my business.
Do unto others what you would have them do unto you.

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

1
FollowupID: 895086

Follow Up By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 08:44

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 08:44
.
Ahh, thanks Chris.

I wondered if it may be some crafty technical reason like simultaneous transmission.

Re "advancing years" perhaps I should get half-a-dozen. Lol
Cheers
Allan

Member
My Profile  My Blog  Send Message

2
FollowupID: 895090

Follow Up By: HKB Electronics - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 09:42

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 09:42
Chris,

I didn't think the authorities would allow you to register the unit with them if the battery is out of date?

Forget about the battery replacement if your thinking manufactures replacement, GME for instance charge more to replace the battery than you cn buy a new one off Ebay. Like apple a few years back, their not interested in replacing batteries.
HKB Electronics

Business Member
My Profile  Send Message

1
FollowupID: 895092

Follow Up By: Member - Stephen L (Clare SA) - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 14:17

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 14:17
Hi HKB

I am in the very same situation as Chris, and carry both my new and old PLS’s.

On the renewal registration form, apart from the usual questions, one of the required questions asks the expiry date of the battery that is in the PLB.

I have both units registered and they did not query my original unit with the expired battery date.

I did enquire about a battery replacement, but there was very little price difference, so I went for a new unit.

And speaking of replacement batteries, this is where it opens up a complete c@n of worms.......

My new, as well as my old GME PLB came with a 7 year warranty, with GME guaranteing the battery for 7 years. If I went down the lines of a battery replacement, they can not guarantee the 7 year battery life, which sounds crazy, seeing they are replacing it at the GME workshop in Sydney.



Cheers



Stephen
Roxby Downs Special

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

1
FollowupID: 895098

Follow Up By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 19:58

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 19:58
.
Seems a bit complex maintaining two PLB's, one being beyond the battery expiry date.
Which one do you initiate first? And how long after initiation do you wait before initiating the second one? Or do you initiate both at the same time?

Whilst I endorse and carry a PLB, I am aware that they have a limitation that there is no acknowledgement that they have correctly transmitted or that their transmission has been received, identified and accepted for action.

At least one of the advantages of a satphone is that someone says "hello" (hopefully). But yes, no need to counsel me on the relative benefits of each. As I said, I endorse and carry both.
I got rid of the St Christopher medal..... it kept tangling with the radio knob! lol
Cheers
Allan

Member
My Profile  My Blog  Send Message

1
FollowupID: 895100

Follow Up By: Member - Stephen L (Clare SA) - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 22:46

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 22:46
Hi Allan

If it was a life and death situation, I would activate both PLB’s, the SOS on the SPOT if I could not get help after dialing 000 on my Satphone first.

Another advantage with the SPOT that many people may or not be aware of, is you can cancel the SOS after you have activated it, and you keep using it as normal after that.

The moment that a PLB is activated, you can not disarm them and when you are found, the units are then a throw away commodity.



Cheers


Stephen
Roxby Downs Special

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

2
FollowupID: 895101

Follow Up By: Idler Chris - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 22:53

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 22:53
Easy answer Allan.

I have the out of date one always in my camper and the in date one in the vehicle. If I only had one PLB I would have to move it between the vehicle and the camper every night and every morning. With Mr Murphy lurking in the background, the time I forget to move it will be the day that I have an emergency.

In an emergency my choice would be to set off the PLB with the battery in date and my SPOT device. This gives the Australian Maritime Safety Authority two alerts which indicates that there is a real emergency as my actions are obviously intentional.
However it depends on the emergency. If it was night and I was in my camper and I had a heart turn or was under attack from outside I would only be able to get to the PLB I had with me in the camper. The track record of these devices working and saving lives is pretty good so you have to accept that they work, you usually have no other choice. As I said before I would if at all possible always set of at least two devices.

As for sat phones, I will always have one and would highly recommend them to everyone. Sat phones do not always get reception exactly when you need it so as good as they are, they are not as reliable as a PLB. When they do work they are great because you can convey to the outside world the nature of your emergency and the assistance required. With my SPOT device at the end of the day I press the "Have arrived at our overnight stop. All OK" button. This action alerts my family with a SMS message and also send a SMS to my own mobile phone. This message if I am in a mobile phone coverage area always gets to my mobile within a minute. This indicates to me that if I should activate my SPOT device that the SPOT company will see my alarm within the same time frame, and pass the information to the Australian Maritime Safety Authority very quickly. I see no reason why a PLB would not be the same time frame. Using a sat phone would take much longer and be much hard, and maybe impossible, in an emergency situation.
Provided you have provided the Australian Maritime Safety Authority with your sat phone details, and you turn it on, you can expect a phone call from them without delay seeking verification of an emergency and the nature of it.

What should now be evident is that each device has its distinct advantages, no one device covers all situations. With the addition of each device you increase your level of preparedness. Emergencies can take many forms, so the more devices you have in your armoury, the better the outcomes are likely to be. I do not have an HF radio but many do. If you have one it gives you more options than if you do not have one, and there are many travellers who swear by them.

This is what I think and do so I hope this helps.

Chris
What other people think of me is none of my business.
Do unto others what you would have them do unto you.

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

2
FollowupID: 895103

Follow Up By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 23:11

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 23:11
.
Stephen, The GME Manual does describe how to simply de-activate the device, but I'm not sure why you would want to.
Cheers
Allan

Member
My Profile  My Blog  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 895105

Follow Up By: 9900Eagle - Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 04:30

Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 04:30
Alan, the reason for deactivation is when the unit is removed from service it can't cause any problems. End of life
0
FollowupID: 895106

Follow Up By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 08:40

Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 08:40
.
No Eagle, perhaps you should read the GME Instructions.

On pages 6/7 there are instructions for 'Activating', 'De-activating, and 'Permanently Disabling the Beacon'.

And on page 4 is... "Should there be an inadvertent activation it is the responsibility of the user to immediately switch the beacon off and notify the nearest RCC (Rescue Coordination Centre)."
Cheers
Allan

Member
My Profile  My Blog  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 895108

Follow Up By: 9900Eagle - Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 09:08

Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 09:08
Well there you go learn something all the time.

Then again if you knew the answer why did you ask.
0
FollowupID: 895109

Follow Up By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 09:39

Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 09:39
.
Eagle, Geez mate, read the context of the posts. My question was to Stephen who was discussing the differences between the Spot and PLB devices and had said........

"Another advantage with the SPOT that many people may or not be aware of, is you can cancel the SOS after you have activated it, and you keep using it as normal after that.
The moment that a PLB is activated, you can not disarm them and when you are found, the units are then a throw away commodity."

I was curious why Stephen may wish to....."cancel the SOS after you have activated it".... which implied that the activation had been intentional, not accidental and that is why I asked. (Hello...... Stephen?)

Incidentally, there is more to it than just switching the thing off. The instructions also state..... "Should there be an inadvertent activation it is the responsibility of the user to immediately switch the beacon off and notify the nearest RCC (Rescue Coordination Centre)."

Cheers
Allan

Member
My Profile  My Blog  Send Message

2
FollowupID: 895110

Follow Up By: Member - Stephen L (Clare SA) - Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 10:08

Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 10:08
Hi Allan

Sorry for not getting back straight way, I was replaying to a post above about the eastern end on the Old Gunbarrel Highway and adding a photo or more.....lol

What I meant to say was, that once a GME PLB has been activated, it is then a throughway commodity, and can not be used again (I was told this by the GME Rep at work), whereas with the SPOT, once you hold down the SOS button to turn the function off, the unit is not a throughway item and can be used over and over again.

Hope that clear that up.



Cheers



Stephen the slow coach.......lol
Roxby Downs Special

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

1
FollowupID: 895111

Follow Up By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 11:40

Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 11:40
.
Yes Stephen, I would consider that if the PLB had been activated 'in anger' then it should be replaced. However and surprisingly, I can find no such instruction in the GME User Manual other than reporting the initiation. (Maybe tell the Rep?)

The manual does deal with deactivation following accidental activation but does not go on to say that the unit should be removed from service. It does say that if deactivation is performed within 60 seconds then NO emergency signal will have been transmitted, which could lead to a belief that "She'll be right mate, just switch it off and put it back in the glovebox".

Technically, no irreversible circuit effect takes place on activation other than battery consumption so the device could be considered to be re-useable following a very short period of operation, just as periodic testing consumes a little of the battery..... but, well..... I wouldn't push my luck too far.
The Spot batteries are of course user rechargeable/replaceable so no worries on that score.


Cheers
Allan

Member
My Profile  My Blog  Send Message

1
FollowupID: 895114

Follow Up By: Baz - The Landy - Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 18:06

Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 18:06
My PLB is an ACR – ResQLink that I purchased in 2013 for $350.

This week I had it serviced as the battery life had expired. The service cost, which included a battery and gasket replacement, along with a test of the electronics was $180.

The expiry date for the new battery is 2024. So by the time it gets to 2024, 11 years down the track, the cost to me will be $4 per month.

The retail price for the unit is still around $350, however Snowy’s (and probably others) have them at a price of $299.

Out of interest, I understand ACR will replace free of charge the unit if it is activated leading to a rescue – you just need to do a “write-up” of the event. Of course you need to survive to do that, so I guess it will always be a "positive" for ACR...

Stay safe out there,

Cheers, Baz – The Landy
“Those who don’t think
it can be done shouldn’t
bother the person doing it…”

Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 895209

Follow Up By: Member - Stephen L (Clare SA) - Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 19:53

Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 19:53
Hi Baz

GME have been giving out a free replacement PLB in the event of a genuine emergency.

I thought that would get more than 5 years out of your original battery, as GME guarantee a 7 year life on the MT410 PLS’s.

When my current PLB is out of battery date, I will be swapping over the KTI for $259 with a 10 year battery life.

One thing I was not aware of, but not all PLB’s are the same. I know that the GME is suitable for aviation use, as well as KTI, something I was not aware of until a friend had the replace his GME and before purchasing the KTI had to check with the authorities to see if it was compatible.



Cheers



Stephen
Roxby Downs Special

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

1
FollowupID: 895213

Follow Up By: Baz - The Landy - Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 20:10

Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 20:10
Hi Stephen

Battery replacement due at 6 years from date of manufactures. Round numbers I probably bought it about 5 1/2 years ago...

Cheers, Baz
“Those who don’t think
it can be done shouldn’t
bother the person doing it…”

Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 895214

Follow Up By: Member - McLaren3030 - Sunday, Dec 02, 2018 at 16:35

Sunday, Dec 02, 2018 at 16:35
Hi Baz,

"The expiry date for the new battery is 2024. So by the time it gets to 2024, 11 years down the track, the cost to me will be $4 per month."

2024 is not 11 years down the track Baz, only 6 years.

Macca.
Macca.

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Position  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 895267

Follow Up By: Baz - The Landy - Sunday, Dec 02, 2018 at 17:28

Sunday, Dec 02, 2018 at 17:28
Hi Macca

Will be 11 years from original purchase date of 2013...

Cheers, Baz - The Landy
“Those who don’t think
it can be done shouldn’t
bother the person doing it…”

Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

1
FollowupID: 895268

Follow Up By: Member - McLaren3030 - Monday, Dec 03, 2018 at 09:52

Monday, Dec 03, 2018 at 09:52
Hi Baz, thanks for the clarification, make sense now.

Macca.
Macca.

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Position  Send Message

1
FollowupID: 895282

Reply By: Baz - The Landy - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 10:00

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 10:00
Much needs to be done to ensure all visitors to remote and outback areas in Australia, whether they are foreign tourists or seasoned outback travellers, are well appraised of the risks associated with remote area travel and take steps to mitigate those risks to an acceptable level.

And it is worth noting, remote doesn’t necessarily mean in the centre of Australia, hundred’s of kilometres from the nearest help – it could be within 50-kilometres of one of our major cities.

Many, hopefully all, who visit the ExplorOz pages, whether via the forum, trek notes, articles or combination of all, are tapping into the information provided and take a considered approach to remote area and outback travel.

Of course, there is a plethora of information available to those who “Google” the topic and much of this is provided by various government agencies and motoring organisations. And there are many private blogs and articles on the topic of remote area and outback travel.

The issue becomes one of how to ensure people are asking the right questions before they travel in these areas.

Those with an interest in travelling remotely and in the outback may already be tapped into a local four-wheel drive club giving exposure to more seasoned and experienced travellers. Adding, this is a very good way to gain valuable experience in many facets of touring in a four-wheel drive vehicle.

Government workers and those associated with the mining and exploration industries will normally (should be) tapped into the nuances of remote and outback travel via Occupational Work and Health Safety Policies of the organisations they work for.

There remains a very large group of people, who might be temporary visitors coming to Australia to experience the Australian Outback or your next door neighbour (I use the term figuratively) who decides they want to experience the “Australian Interior”.

The question is how to ensure these people get the information that in many cases they don’t know they need and what questions to ask?

Foreign tourists hiring four-wheel drive vehicles are usually provided with information at the point of hire, although perhaps it is a bit late at this time and hopefully they have done research prior to coming through the airport gate.

And of course, your next door neighbour who might be someone who has spent most of their life in a major east-coast city or regional centre and does not have an appreciation of the services, or lack thereof, in remoter parts of Australia.

Most Australian’s are used to using a mobile phone wherever they are, or finding a tap dispensing clean drinking water, so it would come as no surprise there might be an expectation that is the case anywhere they travel – how do we ensure they get the required information?

Shane, in his post, highlights a risk that many think all they need to travel this great country of ours is a four-wheel drive vehicle, that are usually advertised on media showing them travelling anywhere you want to go as long as you’ve got a GPS to point you in the right direction. Potentially, a dangerous trap to those who simply head out the front gate without giving much more thought to the risks they unfortunately might be blissfully unaware of.

Even the naming of some of our iconic tracks is a trap for the uninformed.

The Anne Beadell Highway is anything but a “Highway”. The Great Central Road is far from being a “road” most people are accustomed to in less remote parts of Australia.

And highways always have a Caltex Servo with McDonald’s serving burgers morning noon and night for the adventurous traveller, right?

Wrong…

But for those who see these terms, whether foreigners who have little concept of the size of Australia and distance between towns or locals who may have had little or no exposure to remote and outback Australia this is another potential trap luring them into a false sense of security.

Those of us who travel regularly and safely in remote areas and the outback will usually have a checklist, whether mental or otherwise of what we need to consider. Importantly, a plan of where we are going, the objective, and the milestones that should be met as the travel or expedition unfolds, along with an action plan of how to respond to issues or incidents as they arise.

The key is to get others to gain that mindset before venturing beyond the city limits.

I’m not sure how this can be done more effectively to reach the target audience, ultimately a simple “Google” is all that it takes to ask about remote area travel or travel in outback Australia.

But what we can do is promote on ExplorOz an environment that encourages people who venture this way to ask questions and that responses are made in a congenial way…

Personally, my approach is to always have a plan of what I want to achieve and importantly, within that plan I have a set of milestone’s I expect to meet as the trip unfolds and a response as to what to do if it isn’t working out as anticipated. This might include abandoning the trip and retracing my steps.

Many people come unstuck by not recognising when things are not working out as planned and layered on top of that is often a reluctance to act even when it is obvious that something is going wrong until it is too late. It is at this point things often spiral out of control…

And for this reason, I think the first chapter of any book on remote area and outback travel should cover “Survival” techniques.

I suggest this for two reasons…

If you don’t read from chapter two onwards, at least you are likely to be better informed on how to survive when it all goes pear-shaped.

And secondly, if you at least read chapter one on survival, hopefully it should become more obvious to the reader what is needed for successful remote area and outback travel if this is what you need to do to survive – in the least it might spur further reading…

Good luck out there, and take care in your travels…

Cheers, Baz – The Landy
“Those who don’t think
it can be done shouldn’t
bother the person doing it…”

Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

AnswerID: 622285

Follow Up By: Baz - The Landy - Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 07:41

Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 07:41
This is a blog I wrote on the topic of the 406 PLB.

Thought it might be worth putting it in this thread.

"PLB Activation - Help the authorities help you!"

Often in discussion around the campfire, or in the EO forum, the question is asked...

...“Which PLB should I buy…?”

And there are numerous on the market of varying sizes and prices that will do the job they are intended to do.

This discussion relates specifically to 406 MHz beacons that are designed to communicate with the international satellite system, Cospas-Sarsat.

The Cospas-Sarsat Programme is an inter-governmental co-operative of 43 countries and agencies. It maintains a network of satellites and ground facilities to receive distress signals from 406-MHz beacons and route the alerts to the proper authorities in more than 200 countries and territories.

Moving on, once you have made your choice and purchased a PLB what should you do next?

Register it with the Australian Maritime Safety Authority (AMSA)!

Noting, registration is mandatory and can easily be completed online.

The registration process requires you to create an account with the AMSA in which you will be asked to provide emergency contact details for you and others you nominate, including a provision to provide details of your travelling vehicle.

Importantly, a great feature of your account with the AMSA is the ability to upload travel plans or detail a trip you are undertaking.

It is worth underscoring this point and the purpose of this blog is to do that...

Let's face it, you've gone to the expense of purchasing a PLB just in case "the proverbial" hits the fan so give the authorities as much information as you can so they can quickly render assistance in your time of need.

And let's hope you don't need it, but just in case...!

In the event your beacon is activated the first thing the AMSA will do is to review your account for emergency contacts and any trip or further information you have entered.

And whilst they have a set protocol to follow once beacon activation is detected, it will assist them, and ultimately you, if they have current information on your travel plans and up-to-date emergency contact information.

For longer trips and expeditions I detail travel information with approximate dates in an excel spreadsheet and upload into the AMSA website under “My Account”.

This will (hopefully) enable authorities to conclude that if my PLB is activated it correlates with my travel plans, quickly giving the AMSA a higher level of confidence that most likely I really do need help…!

And remember, you purchased a PLB in case you need urgent assistance, don’t second guess what might be determined an emergency.

If you think that a situation has developed that is, or may lead to a life-threatening situation don’t waste time procrastinating about it – hit that emergency button, your life may depend on it...!
“Those who don’t think
it can be done shouldn’t
bother the person doing it…”

Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

3
FollowupID: 895107

Reply By: Michael H9 - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 15:08

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 15:08
I was talking to a guy at a fuel pump at Wanaaring, he was in a hire 4wd and told by the hire company that he must keep his tyre pressures at 45psi or he'd lose his bond. There's a misleading recipe for a bogging event right there for an inexperienced 4wder. I think mandatory plb's for hirers is the only sensible answer. Education is not possible.
AnswerID: 622286

Follow Up By: KevinE - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 22:50

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 22:50
Agreed!

We recently happened upon a middle aged Swiss couple in a hired 4x4 dual cab with all the bells & whistles, that had blown their 2nd tyre near the Qld border, after coming up the Plenty Hwy. It was 40C, there was no shade to speak of & they weren't used to the heat.

They had been told similar to what your people at Wanaaring were told. Crazy stuff!

They had 2 spares, one in the canopy & one under the Ute. But they had not been shown how to get the spare from under the Ute & he was struggling big time, trying to work it out.

He looked like he was in real trouble health wise when we got there, but improved dramatically when help arrived.

We helped them get the tyre changed & explained about tyre pressures on corrugated roads (they both refused the offer of a cool drink). He immediately dropped the tyre pressures, but she was extremely nervous about him doing so.

This Ute was extremely well fitted out. It's a crying shame that it seemed that there was insufficient training from the hirer on how to use what they had hired!

We went onto Jervois for the night & there was a German couple there with a blown tyre on a hired 4WD......................... the cycle continues!
3
FollowupID: 895102

Reply By: Member - shane r1 - Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 23:02

Monday, Nov 26, 2018 at 23:02
Thanks everyone for the replies/ discussion
And don’t stop yet if you’ve got some input.

Adding to my original post/comments, I have seen at times when someone has asked a question, some people have said “use the search function “ and not given any other information/comments.
It is true there’s a lot of info on exploroz, but to be sort of fobbed off like that ,potentially stops someone asking ! And asking and getting answers is educating the person looking for info/advice.
As I said let’s try to be helpful.
Cheers
AnswerID: 622290

Reply By: Member - Mark C (QLD) - Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 04:51

Tuesday, Nov 27, 2018 at 04:51
We use the Garmen InReach Explorer. Sat communication via text with app for phone plus emergency button for PLB. Cheaper per month than Spot and on the plan can pause membership when not travelling. Can up plan to track per time or km and with map tracking if needed. Similar with family able to follow and also sends preset text to family for free when leaving and stopping so they can see when you have stopped for night. Also uses iridium sat system in intrasat like spot so has coverage 100% of the world not tropic to tropic.
Always have UHF and with Garmin, may also get a PLB as backup.
Mark And Helen QLD
Living the Dream

Member
My Profile  My Position  Send Message

AnswerID: 622293

Follow Up By: Member - McLaren3030 - Wednesday, Nov 28, 2018 at 11:02

Wednesday, Nov 28, 2018 at 11:02
Hi Mark,

Just looking at the Garmin In Reach, I am a little confused with regard to the pricing of the plans. The details on line state that there cost for a 12 month plan for the Expedition Plan is $75 or $99 if adding the Freedom Plan to your contract. This means that for long term travel you would be paying almost $1,200 per year, whereas the Spot Gen3 is only $349 per year.

Am I correct in this, or am I missing something?

Macca.
Macca.

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Position  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 895137

Reply By: Member - Mark C (QLD) - Wednesday, Nov 28, 2018 at 17:14

Wednesday, Nov 28, 2018 at 17:14
When I signed for my plan I had 2 options. One a part time which I had 4 options, from $25/ mth to $55/mth. The one I am on I can pause and reactivate as needed. Check your coverage with the spot also.
Mark And Helen QLD
Living the Dream

Member
My Profile  My Position  Send Message

AnswerID: 622321

Reply By: terryt - Wednesday, Nov 28, 2018 at 19:42

Wednesday, Nov 28, 2018 at 19:42
I have read most of these posts and the recommendations of what you should carry, and the suggestion that it may be mandatory. For the vast majority of travellers carrying anything more than a UHF(if that) is like not crossing the road in case some lunatic hits you.You don't need any bells and whistles to travel the Oodnadatta, Strezlecki, GCR etc etc. I would really like to know how many people have been rescued because they set off an epirb in the bush. ie they would have died without it. The people who carry an epirb etc are generally more aware of how to keep themselves safe anyway negating the need for it. As an ex prime minister said (and he got bagged for it} shit happens. You can't save people from themselves.
AnswerID: 622324

Follow Up By: 9900Eagle - Wednesday, Nov 28, 2018 at 20:24

Wednesday, Nov 28, 2018 at 20:24
I don't know if there is data base in Australia for that, but there is worldwide and it is for tens of thousands of people.

I carry one because (SHIT HAPPENS) to experienced and novice travellers. Will it save me, F knows, but at least I have given myself/ wife and others a chance and I would hate to lose the bride, as I would have no one to argue with. I have to look after her, as she reminds me what a F wit I can be.

Have a look on my earlier post about a local farmer. It saved his life.

1
FollowupID: 895149

Follow Up By: Greg J1 - Wednesday, Nov 28, 2018 at 20:33

Wednesday, Nov 28, 2018 at 20:33
Terry. Have you read the book written by the Birdsville cop Shane McNeal?

At one stage in the book he lists the reason why you should set of the epirb. One of those reasons is set it off if you run out of chardanay!!My sister in law would set it off if she chipped a fingernail lol.

Cheers Greg
0
FollowupID: 895150

Follow Up By: Michael H9 - Wednesday, Nov 28, 2018 at 21:02

Wednesday, Nov 28, 2018 at 21:02
Here's a thought that hasn't been mentioned. I've noticed that people with a bullbar travel faster at night than I do with no bullbar. People with a snorkel will attempt water crossings that people without a snorkel won't. The point being, if you don't have the equipment, you are probably less likely to need the equipment because you might be more conservative in your actions. This of course doesn't apply to idiots.
1
FollowupID: 895154

Follow Up By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 00:49

Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 00:49
.
Terry,

The AMSA website publishes some information of the rescues they have dealt with. The link is here.

Their text says... "In 2015–16, our joint aviation and maritime rescue coordination centre coordinated a total of 436 searches, which resulted in the rescue of 207 people across 7370 incidents. A representative sample of these incidents is below."
(But I cannot correlate those numbers)

The samples begin with Marine Incidents then continue to Aviation and Land Based Incidents. They cover the years from 2013 to 2016. I don't know what happened after that.

Cheers
Allan

Member
My Profile  My Blog  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 895158

Follow Up By: Member - McLaren3030 - Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 17:18

Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 17:18
terryt,

"You don't need any bells and whistles to travel the Oodnadatta, Strezlecki, GCR etc etc."

This is a pretty broad sweeping statement, it really depends on the time of year when you are travelling, and the ambient conditions. The Strezlecki & GCR in the middle of summer can get pretty hot, and are far less travelled in that time period. The Oodnadatta may be well travelled, but not the side track out to Halligans Bay on Lake Eyre, particularly in summer. Having an EPIRB or PLB will greatly shorten the time before an adequate responder arrives at your accident/incident site.

Macca.
Macca.

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Position  Send Message

1
FollowupID: 895166

Follow Up By: Idler Chris - Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 17:47

Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 17:47
terryt

Most people here want to control their own destiny and not be reliant on someone else coming along to save their bacon.
Having an emergency plan which involves relying on other people turning up and be willing to help, would to many people, be irresponsible.

Consider an emergency of say a snakebite or car accident with serious injuries. Time could be of significant importance. With your attitude you would have to wait for an unknown time for help to arrive which could well turn out to be to late.

Tragedies in the outback appear in the news all to frequently. If people carried a PLB these tragedies would significantly reduce, if not disappear.

If people do not value their own lives to get a PLB, at least think about your family and loved ones at home and the distress they would suffer should the worst happen.
Chris
What other people think of me is none of my business.
Do unto others what you would have them do unto you.

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

2
FollowupID: 895167

Follow Up By: Baz - The Landy - Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 18:17

Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 18:17
PLBs are like car insurance, you don’t need it till it all goes pear shape, at that point you wouldn’t be without it...

And who knows where you might need it, could be in the middle of no-where, or possibly even in one of Sydney’s National Parks - plenty of opportunity to come unstuck anywhere.

Remote by my definition is anywhere you can’t easily be located...

The key thing if you carry one is not to second guess whether you should use it. If you think the situation you are in could possibly put your life in danger before you can self-rescue, then hit the button.

Delaying activation can change the dynamics from a rescue to a body recovery - and neither the authorities or emergency agencies want that...


Cheers, Baz - The Landy
“Those who don’t think
it can be done shouldn’t
bother the person doing it…”

Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 895168

Follow Up By: equinox - Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 18:58

Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 18:58
Hey Baz - Gee I didn't think I'd get drawn into this but have to disagree with you on one of your points (second guessing yourself).
I've been in a few sticky situations where others may have pushed the button.
If I hadn't given it my best shot to get out by myself I would never have forgiven myself. As it turns out I didn't need help after all - In those situations it would be so easy to push the button and let others take care of you but I have more self respect than that.
Don't push the button unless you really really really have too. That is, there are no longer any reasonable options.
cheers
Alan

Edit PS - What I said doesn't really matter anyway as the word reasonable is open to wide interpretation
Looking for adventure.
In whatever comes our way.

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  Send Message

2
FollowupID: 895170

Follow Up By: Idler Chris - Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 20:26

Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 20:26
The definition of what are "reasonable options" to a person who goes into the middle of nowhere looking for a crashed Kookaburra would be a lot different to that of most others I would suggest.
cheers,
Chris
What other people think of me is none of my business.
Do unto others what you would have them do unto you.

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

1
FollowupID: 895172

Follow Up By: Baz - The Landy - Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 20:34

Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 20:34
Well, I’m hearing you Equinox, but there is an element of rolling the dice.

For sure you get to decide whether to push the button or not, and nothing wrong with backing yourself, but get it wrong or leave it too late and it might become a body recovery...

Mind you, everyone is different, and all food for thought and no shame in pressing the button if you believe you are in a life threatening situation. That is what the authorities will say.

Bear in mind, the choice might end up being the difference in being able to recount the story; or dead...but don’t let pride get in the way and be the decider for
you...


Cheers Baz
“Those who don’t think
it can be done shouldn’t
bother the person doing it…”

Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

1
FollowupID: 895173

Follow Up By: skulldug - Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 21:32

Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 21:32
Idler,

How does having a PLB make you not reliant on others?

Who is it that rescues you if you activate it?
0
FollowupID: 895177

Follow Up By: Idler Chris - Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 22:00

Thursday, Nov 29, 2018 at 22:00
A rescue instigated by setting off a PLB is a taxpayer funded emergency service with professionally trained people who are able to do it as quickly and safely as possible.
Without a PLB you are relying on the next person who comes along and its pot luck if they can help and there is always the potential that some well meaning person who tries to help could actually make it worse.
Chris
What other people think of me is none of my business.
Do unto others what you would have them do unto you.

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

1
FollowupID: 895179

Follow Up By: Ron N - Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 00:51

Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 00:51
I'll wager this bloke would have given anything for an EPIRB or a SPOT - and all because of a loose compass mount!

S##* happens to the best of navigators, four-wheel drivers, bushies, pilots, and highly experienced Outback people.

http://www.adastra.adastron.com/people/wackett-1.htm

It's nice to know you can get a message out, and someone will come looking for you, when everything that could go wrong, has gone wrong.

I've seen the devastation on peoples faces (several times) when they have simply rolled their 'van on the highway.

In a split second, their home is gone, their transport is gone, their holiday plans are out the window - and they are faced with trying to piece their lives back together, far from home, and relying solely on the helpfulness of total strangers.

And that's if they have survived with only minor injuries. If you're badly injured or incapacitated, you can do very little to help yourself.

I've known a farmer who died agonisingly over a week, trapped between a front-end loader and a truck.
I wonder what he would have paid for some emergency communication ability? Everything he owned, I'll wager.

Cheers, Ron.
2
FollowupID: 895189

Reply By: Idler Chris - Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 12:35

Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 12:35
Greg J1 refered to the book by the previous Birdsville OIC Shane and his ideas on how to survive in the outback.

Friday Five published by Westprint Maps by email every Friday has an article from the current OIC, Birdsville Stephan Pursell on this subject.

You can read it here
https://www.westprint.com.au/newsletter-2018-11-30

Chris
What other people think of me is none of my business.
Do unto others what you would have them do unto you.

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

AnswerID: 622350

Reply By: Gary W3 - Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 16:26

Friday, Nov 30, 2018 at 16:26
A number of posters have supported the education idea and this is really the major way to reduce travel trauma - but not the only one!
Legislation is often needed to protect people from themselves as well as others. It's the price to pay for bad behaviour and lack of education from others.
Despite having some good bush knowledge, I joined a 4X4 club because I hadn't had any real experience with off road driving. Brilliant move! Apart from the wealth of information and guidance, I have joined a like-minded group who enjoy the bush challenges and care for it while having a lot of fun. The social life is the added bonus. I have done a 4X4 course, First Aid, chain saw course and a host more through them. I now feel more prepared and can recognise potential hazards a lot better. It's good to what to know what to DO, but better to know what NOT to do!!
We need more travellers to join self help groups like clubs, and to tap into local knowledge more. Enhances the whole concept of getting out.
Good thread. :)
AnswerID: 622351

Reply By: Idler Chris - Sunday, Dec 02, 2018 at 14:21

Sunday, Dec 02, 2018 at 14:21
It looks like an essential bit of equipment is an axe.

https://www.facebook.com/benngunnfans/videos/318870045618855/UzpfSTEwMDAwMDIxNzkzNDk2NDoyNDMwOTYzNDc2OTQ2MzA2/

A couple of the brothers might help as well.

RAOTFL Chris
What other people think of me is none of my business.
Do unto others what you would have them do unto you.

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

AnswerID: 622406

Reply By: Ron N - Tuesday, Dec 04, 2018 at 00:25

Tuesday, Dec 04, 2018 at 00:25
I was just thinking today (on our first 38 deg day, with the air-con fan on setting 3 out of 4) - how modern, comfortable, fully-air-conditioned vehicles really must lull people into a lack of situational awareness, when it comes to outside, real-world conditions.

I'll wager a lot of these people who get stuck, are unaware just how severe the real weather conditions are, outside their very comfortable temperature, highly mobile, insulated steel cage, called their car.

It led me to remember how when the brother, SIL and I were living on our gold mine in the mid-1980's, at Higginsville, 60kms North of Norseman - and we decided to have a break in Esperance, on a long weekend during Summer.

We took the brothers near-new HJ61, and spent the long weekend in Esperance, where it was about 25 deg each day - and we had a great time.

We took off back to Higginsville in the early morning - without studying any weather reports - and the brother floored the 'Cruiser to his normal "quite a few kms above the speed limit", on the beautiful long smooth straights of the Coolgardie-Esperance Rd.

We had the superb Toyota factory air-conditioning cranked up - but after a couple of hours, the Toyota temperature gauge started to rise appreciably.

We were trying to figure out why the engine temperature would rise so much on a 25 deg day - even though we were humming along, it was normal cruise speed for the brother and the near-new 'Cruiser - and it never overheated.

We started to discuss if the outside air temperature had risen more than we had realised - so we wound down the windows, only to be greeted with an outside temperature running about 42 degrees!!

We were stunned by the fact that the great Toyota air-conditioning had masked the fact that, despite it being only 25 deg in Esperance - we were running into a heat trough centred over the Goldfields, and also straight into a stinking hot Northerly wind, that was like a blast furnace!

The brother backed off the speed, and the engine temperature came down, even though it was still higher than normal.

It was a sobering reminder that weather and ambient conditions can change very rapidly, when travelling long distances over a few hours - particularly when leaving the coast, and heading due inland, in the middle of Summer.

Cheers, Ron.

AnswerID: 622445

Popular Content

Popular Products (14)