Which 4wd is the best?
Submitted: Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 02:25
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Member - Richard
Sorry about the title - could not think of anything else.
I am considering
buying a 4wd and am not sure which one as so many options - the big issue is cost so am looking for second hand.
I am looking for something that is reliable and will take me most
places as am planning a trip around OZ in a year or so and lots of other trips in between - I hope. I would also be towing a camper, some trips or caravan if I upgrade that as
well.
Here are a few questions I hope people can help with.
Is diesel better than petrol (economy and performance)
Which make/model is best (don't want to start a turf war here as it does seem there are a lot of good makes/models around).
I have been looking at (in magazines)
. Prado
. Patrol - 3.0L DX or ST or ?
. Land cruiser ?
. Jeep
What sort of mileage is acceptable for a secondhand car
Any other things you can think of?
Any hope you can help,
Richard
Reply By: Member - glenno (QLD) - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 09:18
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 09:18
Get a troopy
AnswerID:
85124
Reply By: GaryInOz (Vic) - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 09:18
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 09:18
...the best for????
on road/off road? - "around OZ" can be very different things to different ppl. You can drive around Australia in a Corolla.......
Weight of camper - large bearing on what vehicle you need
Diesel better economy, petrol better performance.
Acceptable milage is very different in cars vs. 4wds. a car at 200 000 km is usually stuffed, a 4wd (Nissan GQ petrol/diesel) is generally only just worn in with a good several hundred thou to go.
AVOID electronic gimmickery, correct driving technique is safer.
Do an accredited 4wd
driver training for you AND your partner (in the event that you cannot drive through accident etc.).
Ensure that vehicle can be run after airbag deployment.
..................and the list goes on.............
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In short, there is NO "BEST" 4wd, there is only a 4wd that best suits YOUR needs. The real issue is to accurately identify your needs, and then come back with all the information.
AnswerID:
85125
Follow Up By: Peter - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 09:57
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 09:57
is that right ??? a veichle wont go after the air bag is deployed even if the veichle is able to be driven
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Blue (VIC) - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 11:43
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 11:43
Hi Peter,
I know it's not a 4by but our factory manager had a 7 series BMW. In a fender bender the airbag was deployed and the computer shut the entire car down even though it appeared completely driveable.
Blue
FollowupID:
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Reply By: Member - Brian (Gold Coast) - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 10:04
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 10:04
GaryInOz has raised some very good points! Everyone will have an opinion on this... but you are the one that has to use the car.
When we decided to get into a 4WD, we did heaps of "homework", spoke with a lot of people, usually not salesmen, met and spoke with members of the local 4X4 club, (to which we now belong!), 4X4 mechanics, internet research, magazines, etc...etc. We spent 4 months tracking down our vehicle, but by then we knew exactly what we wanted and thats what we got!
My 2C worth... in my opinion, Diesel is better than petrol in large 4X4's, our 1995 GQ Patrol had 185000 K's on it when we got it, just run in! But for power then petrol is the go. Remember if you're going "outback", theres an old saying that the outback runs on diesel. Diesel gives much better off road performance as
well through large torque available in lower rev range.
In the Patrol, I would rather the 4.2 turbo diesel than the 3.0 thats just a preference though... you may find different. They are both great cars. The Toyotas are great cars as
well, but you pay more for them as you do with anything Toyota.
It's to do with the build quality etc.... although it's widely accepted that the Patrol has a stronger driveline than just about everything else.
Beware of parts prices and availability for Jeeps/Landies etc.... and while the electronic gimmics are great around town, if they leave you stranded in the bush, they will be of little help.
Lastly, (sorry this has gone on so long!!!!) when you have chosen/purchased one, then make sure you and your partner do a comprehensive 4X4 driver trainer course! It is very important! and then ...... get out and enjoy it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (Oh... and post here to let us know what you're up to and where you are!!!!!!!)
Good luck!!!!!
AnswerID:
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Reply By: Willem - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 10:34
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 10:34
Buy a pre 98 un-computerised diesel 4x4...Toyota Landcruiser or Nissan Patrol 4.2 litre.
Anything else is a compromise
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: Rosco - Bris. - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 18:21
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 18:21
"Anything else is a compromise"
Now that's the first "hands in pants" posting you've made in a while me ol' mate.
Cheers cob
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Follow Up By: Willem - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 19:42
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 19:42
How are you Rosco, me old mate?
Now I know that you lean the other way and by all accounts your lean is just as good as the best in some instances.
I would say however, that if you were unsure of what you were going to do with your 4bie and wanted one as an all rounder with a proven track record in reliabilty, service and longevity and without quirky traits then the best idea would be to go with the two most popular brands.
So many people set out with great ideas on what they want to do with their vehicle and then find out in a short space of time that there are serious shortcomings with their purchase.
With my hands in my pants I am giving directions....lol
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Reply By: Bob of KAOS - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 11:49
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 11:49
Richard,
don't believe a word you read in the magazines. They are just like John Laws - cash for comment. The list you cite is very disparate - do you have any idea of size of vehicle, fuel type, etc. Personally, if I were starting off like you and wanted value, reliability and versatility I would have a serious look at the diesel Pajeros.
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Robb (NSW) - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 18:15
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 18:15
Hi Bob, I would disagree with your opinion on magazines, partly because I work for one and have an insiders view to testing... For the most part magazines have people that drive MANY (if not all) of the 4wds available on the market. Some of them may have leanings one way or the other but so does Johnny Citizen from this
forum... People have opinions and thats great. But if I wanted to know what vehicle to buy, I would rather ask or be informed from someone who has driven a wide range of 4wds than by someone who has driven very few and has a loyalty to a brand "coz they own one".
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Follow Up By: Bob of KAOS - Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 19:10
Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 19:10
Robb,
sorry to defame all journalists writing for such mags - I am sure most of you are straight shooters. My concern is that if Company X has 8 full pages of advertising the editor won't take to kindly to one of you bagging their product in an article.
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Follow Up By: Member - Collyn R (WA) - Monday, Nov 22, 2004 at 11:33
Monday, Nov 22, 2004 at 11:33
Re Bob and Robb
I spent several years as a managing editor with ACP (the Kerry Packer empire). I ran all the scientific and technical magazines. I'd like to comment on Bob's comment re advert pressure - and also to Robb's denial that this can happen etc.
It is not at all uncommon for an advertiser to apply strong pressure on editors and managing editors to change or withdraw an unfavourable review. I had that happen dozens of times. It is however very rare for a magazine to agree. I would have personally fired any editor who did.
The refusal to bow to advt pressure can cost. One of my own magazines (Electronics Today International) lost six-pages a month for two years over such refusal when I advised the owner (in Latin) to 'futue te ipsum'.
That cost the company $144,000. And I had Packer's backing to do it.
There can be however 'unhealthy' relationships between magazine staff and manufacturers. Australian motoring writers in particular are sumptiously wined and dined, and are regularly flown to exotic overseas locations to 'test' new products. It is not unknown for them to return with more than 'token gifts'. After a few years of this it is conceivable that a writer's judgment may become a bit fuzzy.
There is a further and I believe valid point. This is that many such writers are full-on 4WD enthusiasts. It is true that they do have access to a large range of vehicles - and it's not their concern if they break one. But they may not necessarily evaluate products from a general viewpoint.
It is also a fact that some specialist magazines are bought by enthusiasts but are not necessarily participants. Glossy truck magazines are an example - few truckies would be caught dead reading one!
Journalists with such magazines must to some extent write about the sizzle rather than evaluating the steak!
Collyn Rivers
FollowupID:
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Reply By: Member - Collyn R (WA) - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 12:12
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 12:12
You will receive any number of answers to this query - but if you wish to be as close to 100% as feasible to having an ultra-reliable vehicle I'd suggest there are really only two contenders.
1. Toyota 78-series Troopy.
2. 4.2 litre diesel Nissan Patrol
Many others MAY do the job. Either of the above WILL.
Each has its protagonists but both are superb examples of 4WD engineering. I currently have a Troopy but would certainly consider a Patrol were Nissan to have its own service centre in
Broome.
Virtually the whole top end of Australia runs on these vehicles (plus the ubiquitous HiLux).
Collyn Rivers
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: Bob of KAOS - Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 19:12
Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 19:12
Collyn,
your picture is a bit blurry but it looks like a Mitsubishi Star Wagon with a roof extension. Would I be right?
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Follow Up By: Member - Collyn R (WA) - Monday, Nov 22, 2004 at 11:09
Monday, Nov 22, 2004 at 11:09
Bob - the pix is clearer if you click on the Rig/Profile icon.
It's an OKA - made in Western Australia.
Collyn Rivers
FollowupID:
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Reply By: Member - Richard- Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 13:00
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 13:00
Guys,
Thanks for the answers. The truth is I am not sure what I want at this stage. As indicated in one of the replies I am just starting and have plenty of time to look around and get some facts together.
I have a Forestor and have done 4wd driving course for the SUVs, which was great.
The more I do the more I want to do, if you know what I mean.
I would like to be able to go
places the forestor can't go, although it can go a lot more
places than I had thought, after doing the training course. Joining a local 4wd club is a good idea where I can talk to people direct and see what they have.
Any way I will keep looking and doing research.
Thanks again,
Richard
AnswerID:
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Reply By: ianmc - Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 12:10
Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 12:10
Richard, have you considered the great 4wd single cab or twin cab utes which all now have a fair bit of grunt & have been beefed up in the last 2-3 years?
All good performers & in a deisel, quite economical, & have versatility of sleeping in back or ability to carry lots of stuff without cluttering up your camper. Also with some of the deals about they are lots cheaper than wagons.
eg Rodeo, Triton (new one on tha way) Navara.
AnswerID:
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Reply By: Steve - Sunday, Nov 28, 2004 at 22:28
Sunday, Nov 28, 2004 at 22:28
whilst on the topic, I'm thinking of trading my 98 V8 Disco which is an excellent towing vehicle for my usually 1.5 ton laden caravan. Fuel and parts bills have made me see sense. From what I gather I'll probably get a few approving nods when I say I'm thinking of going for a '93 4.2 patrol diesel with after market turbo. I presume this will get me up those long hills at something more than 50kph????Basically, I've got used to towing (conditions permitting) at 100 kph or more and hope this 4be will clip along at something similar????? They're asking practically 20 grand, and although it's in immaculate nick, it's clocked up 190,000 k's. Below avg k's but a bit of wear I'd imagine. Any responses would be appreciated
AnswerID:
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