Caught Speeding !!!

Submitted: Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 20:33
ThreadID: 26716 Views:3892 Replies:16 FollowUps:27
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I recently recieved a notice in the mail from the VIC Police. I was "alledgedly" detected by a speed camera in the Kiewa valley, after coming down the mountain from Falls creek, doing 86kmh in a 80kmh zone. The fine was about $131.00 . Fair is fair, I'll cop it as I deserve it, but I just cant come to grips with 6 kmh over. I'm pretty careful with my speed, mostly always on cruise. I'll pay the fine as I cant afford to go down there to contest it, and couldnt really be bothered anyway.

I'd be interested to find out though, does anyone know how accurate these devices really are.

I'm from QLD and have never heard of someone being done for 6kmh over in an 80kmh zone. I cant say I'm well versed in VIC traffic laws either.

ironic how not so long ago, it was outlaw bushrangers in those areas that carried out highway robbery....
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Reply By: Diamond (Vic) - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 20:40

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 20:40
over here in this great state we only allow 2 ks over if your doing 3 ks over your done.
AnswerID: 131570

Follow Up By: ShnogDog - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 20:44

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 20:44
Fair enough... thats a pretty fine line, but fair enough
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Follow Up By: Exploder - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 20:49

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 20:49
2k’s a car Speedo is not that accurate, in fact I am fairly sure that +-2k’s is the working tolerance of Speedo’s out of the factory.
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Follow Up By: Member - Ivan (ACT) - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 22:39

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 22:39
yep, but the speedo's are set to under measure your speed.. If my Prado is doing an 'actual' speed of 96 Kph, the speedo speed reads 100..

So for you to be doing 102 Kph 'real speed', your speedo speed is probably 107 Kph..

Still a very fine line (and I've broken it many times) - but the speedo/real speed thing is actually in your favour...
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Follow Up By: ShnogDog - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 22:48

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 22:48
Thanks Ivan..good to know
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Follow Up By: Blaze - Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 00:17

Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 00:17
Might be the case on a Prado ivan, but running a GPS which is as far as I know the most accurate measure of speed in a vehicle, A mates new Patrol was doing 116 when the speedo read 110, my Bravo with tyres as delivered was 5klm's out reading over, when I put offroad tyres on it was spot on the money. To top that off, a mate with MTR's fitted has had a variation of 4 klm's since the tyres have worn down to the time to chage for a new set. I believe its a little tight to have a a 2klm tolerance as with even a cruise control you will move at least 5 to 6 k's on most down hill runs. Also funny how they quite often setup on decents Hmmmmm, wonder how many lives that saves.
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Reply By: Exploder - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 20:46

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 20:46
That is a Joke $131 for 6k’s over, that’s complete chit, in WA it would be $50 depending on what the camera was set on. It really is becoming ridicules I can understand getting fined for 20+k’s over the limit but 6k’s and $131 yeah that isn’t revenue raising.

At-least there were no demerit point’s lost only some cash.

The camera’s have been know to have error’s, and can be +-2k’s out
AnswerID: 131572

Follow Up By: ShnogDog - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:05

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:05
Exploder.. I dont have a GPS but have heard of people getting some fairly reasonable variances between the speed on their GPS and the vehicle speedo. Throw a stationery device into the mix and who really knows who was doing what?

Keen to get over to WA one day too btw.
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Follow Up By: Member - Mozza (NSW) - Thursday, Sep 29, 2005 at 18:24

Thursday, Sep 29, 2005 at 18:24
dog...was down the snow this season too.. one guy went flat strap down this mountain with two GPS 's on board... .. and they both returned different readings ? 110klm/h and 116klm/h !..
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Reply By: Member - JohnR (Vic)&Moses - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 20:52

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 20:52
ShnogDog it's not referred to as the nanny state for nothing mate. Just think of the fine being for your own good as our premier and also all his colleagues tell us. Even if you are the only car on the road, yes, it is for your own good.

One of the latest pieces of good done by the government is to advise work experience students with veterinarians that they should not touch animals as they are unpredictable in nature and they may get hurt............ You are not able to learn these days without nanny looking over your shoulder or smacking your hand back.
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Follow Up By: ShnogDog - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:02

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:02
For my own good?.. I'll keep that in mind HAHAHA !!!

Its sad to hear about what is happening with the student vets. What are they going to do when they get a job in the real world. Too much theory and not enough practical skills being taught. But we wont start, thats a whole other can of worms...

Would love to get back down there and into those hills in the summer months though. I always enjoy my visits to your state (despite the odd fine)
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Follow Up By: Exploder - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:03

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:03
Maybe they should just rap everybody up in bubble Rap.

Have any of these ridiculous fines and the Premier’s "advice for the day" reduced the road toll significantly??
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Follow Up By: Member - Bradley- Monday, Sep 26, 2005 at 11:24

Monday, Sep 26, 2005 at 11:24
Yeah i read that the other day in the weekly times, and i'm still shaking my head, work experience without lifting a finger - geez thats usefull.

as it is now a lot of kids come into the workforce and dont want to do anything, so this will only re-inforce it.
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Reply By: Jimbo - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:03

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:03
It's all just tax collection.

86 in an 80 zone is about as dangerous as farting near a campfire.

There are fools who believe in the "reduce 5" campaign of propaganda trotted out by the Vic Govt (of both colours).

The same ads showed how it takes 39 metres to stop from 60 km/h. What absolute bovine faeces. A modern car will pull up from 100km/h (not 60) in 35 to 38 metres.

Still, the great unwashed accept this propaganda. Some fool will surely respond to this and trot out some inane comment along the lines of "if you don't speed, you won't get caught".

Does anyone recall how Nazi Germany got started?
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Follow Up By: ShnogDog - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:23

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:23
Jimbo

about as dangerous as farting near a campfire. ... hehehe I like that one.. but I guess it depends on who's farting and how close to the campfire. In certain company, that could be downright catastrophic !!!

Given a choice, I'd pick farting by a campfire any day... :) LMAO !!!
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Reply By: Sand Man (SA) - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:07

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:07
You can challenge them in court too and ask them to produce evidence as to the accuracy of the device. Of course, if you do and they produce the necessary records, you are in deeper poo because you with have the court costs awarded against you as well.

It's funny but have you noticed that the mongrels always set up their traps on a decline, where they know the law of physics will cause the vehicle to gain extra speed, even if you are using cruise, or sitting on the speed limit.

Unfortunately, we've just got to cop it sweet.

By the way, my speedometer is acurate within 2kph when compared with my GPS.

Bill


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AnswerID: 131583

Follow Up By: angler - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:26

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:26
I have also heard the error can be + or - 10%.

Also the other day someone beat them by demanding the police prove the photo was not doctored to show the incorrect speed.
Apparently no one can determine if a pic has in fact been altered.

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Reply By: Willb - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:17

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:17
I was under the impression that the Australian design rules allow a 10% margin of error.
I stand to be corrected, ( I usually am).
80 k zone, margin of error of 10% = 88 kph.
Any body else have any thoughts along those lines?
Will
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AnswerID: 131586

Follow Up By: Jimbo - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:26

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:26
Not in "Democratic" Victoria.

The Nazis take off 3 km/h as an allowance for radar gun error, and after that "You're nicked Son".

That is, if you're doing 64 in a 60 zone, they take off 3 and nail you for exceeding the limit by 1 km/h you irresponsible prick.
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Follow Up By: 944runner - Monday, Sep 26, 2005 at 11:16

Monday, Sep 26, 2005 at 11:16
Willb, as far as I was aware the ADR rules are for +- 10%.
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Reply By: Nudenut - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:19

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:19
havent I read somewhere that the ADR only calls for speedo's to be =or- 10%
how the bloody hell can they do this beats me?
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Follow Up By: Member - Blue (VIC) - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:55

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:55
Bracksy is an "abigail", that's how...
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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Monday, Sep 26, 2005 at 11:57

Monday, Sep 26, 2005 at 11:57
because nobody has challenged it.
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Reply By: bgreeni - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:52

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 21:52
About the only thing I am not looking forward to in returning to Oz -- The stupid spped laws, after being able to cruise at 90mph with no worries. It really is time that the whole speed limt thing in Australia had a bit of reality about it. Funny how speeds that kill in Oz are safe in other countries, or is it all to do with revenue raising.
AnswerID: 131595

Follow Up By: ShnogDog - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 22:00

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 22:00
Anyone who has driven The Great Ocean Road will have also seen some signposted speed zones of 80 & 100kmh where attemtping anything above 50-60kmh is simply suicidal. That too is in VIC. Where I was snapped was on a straight road. Hmmm.
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Follow Up By: Footloose - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 22:36

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 22:36
Years ago I drove at 140k+for 6 weeks, the local UK motorway limit. The day I got home I took my car for a drive and dammed near killed myself. There is a hell of a lot of difference between the roads here and in Europe etc.
But as a policeman I know said, "you'd have to have rocks in your head to be in traffic." Maybe in Vic they have larger rocks ? :))))
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Follow Up By: Exploder - Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 01:34

Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 01:34
It all depends on the road you are travelling on as in Australia as we have a lot of variety. I.E we Went from Perth to Tom Price Area, once we got above Dalwallinu we sat on 130-140 the hole way (And for a bit I sat behind a guy that was doing 160). It’s all about driving to suite the conditions some road’s you can travel at speed easily other’s require a lot more caution, Up around Coral bay I have come across people towing boat’s doing 120 as there is nothing there and the road is straight).

At the same time I don’t speed around the metro Area and I mostly sit on 110-120 when travelling on country roads.

You need to drive to suite the conditions and your ability, I recently herd about a guy who hit a Cow coming into Meekatharra at Night and he was travelling at 120 (No spotlight’s) Now why would you be doing that sort of speed at night in that Area. If it hadn’t been a Patrol with a Bull bar there is a good chance there would have been 2 dead people, instead of just a written of 4WD, all because of not thinking before acting.
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Follow Up By: Member - JohnR (Vic)&Moses - Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 08:26

Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 08:26
Exploder if you do 110-120 in Victoria over the wrong hill, you may be on mobile radar and $210 for the coffers. Over 125 and you will be walking - instantly. They can take your licence - just like that. People are starting to feel the rebellion well up in their bodies and minds. Others though say you are speeding, you pay. You can never feel that the drivers are alert round the state now as they doze their way round the roads.
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Reply By: Motherhen - Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 23:02

Friday, Sep 23, 2005 at 23:02
When we went to Perth to get the bullbar & winch, my husband was driving in the right hand lane of 3, going slowly, as we were watching for a right turn coming up (we were unfamiliar with the area). I saw the speed camera off to the left of the road but didn't see the flash. How can they say we were travelling fast with two lanes of traffic, travelling faster than us, between us and the camera? Cheaper to pay $50 than go back to Perth to even view the photo. Just revenue raising - i worked out they could have made $36,000 in one morning - I have to work hard for more than a year to achieve that. P--ed off Motherhen
Motherhen

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AnswerID: 131602

Follow Up By: Member - JohnR (Vic)&Moses - Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 08:35

Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 08:35
Motherhen, I am sure the authorities in Western Australia will learn they can up the fines to Victorian levels as the only fine that low here is if you are stopped for too long in the wrong place. Parking fine!

I have driven like Footlose above overseas at 140, feeling quite safe up round the 160-170 on their roads, but what you do learn is that you adjust your speed to the way you feel safe. That is what the traffic doctors tell us too. Where you don't feel the ease of driving, we slow down. Right down where there more people walking to cope with circumstance. Its not the case though in the Nanny State. BANG, your fined!
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Follow Up By: Member - Davoe (Widgiemooltha) - Wednesday, Sep 28, 2005 at 01:43

Wednesday, Sep 28, 2005 at 01:43
Ask to see the photo (yes of course it does cost) But as i understand if there is any possibility of query of the numberplate or iff you are not the only vehicle in the photo - case dismissed, apparantly they do it all the time but if doubts exist with the photo for the few who ask it pays off (lots of work, money and potentially more money which is what they bank on)
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Reply By: hoyks - Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 07:56

Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 07:56
I got a speeding ticket for doing 120 through the tunnel.......and I wasn't even in the state at the time.

Apparently being out of the state is not an acceptable excuse and they wanted to take me to court unless I told them who was driving the vehicle (a rental that 5 others had access to the keys for). It's a bit hard when you aren't there.

Handing speeding fines administration over to a civilian company is not right in my opinion. Atleast the Police can apply some commonsence in situations like this. Civic Compliance were like a dog with a bone.
AnswerID: 131609

Reply By: Alan Southport QLD - Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 09:39

Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 09:39
Just my tuppence worth.
I used to have a very fast bike in Syd - and sold it when i accumulated 11points (1 point to go gulp!).

Anyway, i decided to obtain the actual manuals for the Speed Cameras, Fixed and handheld speed Lider (Spelling?), and Radar.

There is a (Syd based manuals anyway), variance of 2-3%.

But the main point of my post is that there is a condition that if the vechicle is on a decline of suffiecient gradient/angle and will accelerate without anything on the gas pedal, then they can't do you.
They are also not allowed to set up traps (can't remember the distances though), before comiining up to towns and villages.

The best thing to remember is that the fixed (mounted on tripods), manned liders, must be first setup and calibrated for the Cosine effect as it has to aim across from the side of the road to the oncoming traffic [They are really meant to be head on to measure correctly, which is of course not a good thing for the operator!]. The police should write down the calibration settings in a log BEFORE operating it.
So if you get pulled over - and you're feeling as though no exsuces or the wifes now raised dress, is not going to persuade him to give you a warning - then ask to to see the log book and see if they have indeed filled it in [Checking the time and date], if they haven't you're ok. If they have, don't blame me!
NB: I was also informed that a lot of times, they don't fill in the log book, and do it a the end of the shift.

You would also be amazed at the rules concerning the Traffic Speed Cameras - They [Police], should do something with them, but rarely VERY rarely do - and that's one way to get out of them - but i can't let you know everything :)
I know, isn't it terrible and i'm a tease,......lol

Lastly, if you have a good driving record, and had a few kids in the back, and one of them had a 'coughing fit, or going to be car sick', you would have a good 60% chance to get off just by writting this down and pleading for your life. if you did ellect to have it heard by a magistrate, then you would stand a good 95% chance of getting off. if you did lose the court costs would only be a low $50 or so.

Alan.

AnswerID: 131616

Reply By: Member - Russell B (SA) - Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 14:08

Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 14:08
What a bloody hoon , 6km over the speed limit.

I never got a speeding ticket of my own, my son copped a couple drivng my car but officially I'm squeaky clean. One day I be doing what you did and have to cop it sweet cause ofthe other times I didn't get caught.

Do the crime do the time.

hahahahaha

Who's next, me probably

Regards
AnswerID: 131631

Follow Up By: Member - JohnR (Vic)&Moses - Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 15:01

Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 15:01
Russell you will get it interstate as there are lots of distant roads where you are and higher limits. Greater tolerances and fewer police per kilometre to boot. Just ask Muddy about crossing the border to go to the Grampians.

Last one I got was about 8 am on a lonely road with a guy on mobile radar machine. No other car for kilometres and I was on cruise control...........
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Reply By: goodpal50 - Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 18:37

Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 18:37
Just remember that when you pay the fine do not give your drivers license number. They will cash your cheque but if you don't give your drivers licemce then you don't lose points in your home state, as the various states systems are linked. If they don't have your licence then you ca't lose points.
I have been done twice in 10 years both interstate. paid the fines, not given my license number and never been follwed up for it by the state concerned and never had points deducted from my local license.

Mike
AnswerID: 131641

Follow Up By: ShnogDog - Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 19:10

Saturday, Sep 24, 2005 at 19:10
Hah... will give that a go... gotta get something for my $131.00 The thrill of 6kmh over just aint enough !!!
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Follow Up By: Willem - Sunday, Sep 25, 2005 at 09:13

Sunday, Sep 25, 2005 at 09:13
Everything about you and your vehicle is linked.

You get a fine through the mail as you have been snapped speeding. Your rego number relates back to you on the database and your drivers license is there to be seen by all authorities.

After paying $140 for doing 70 in a 60 zone in 2002 I am a bit paranoid about going over the speed limit. Cruise control just under the open road speed limit will keep you out of harms way. The problem arises when one is leaving a town and I always seem to be exceeding the limit between 60/80 and 80/110 restricteds areas while accelerating.

With high fuel prices we now set the cruise at just below 100 and although it is a bit boring to drive at that speed it keeps us out of trouble and it saves fuel.
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Reply By: Mark T - Sunday, Sep 25, 2005 at 18:43

Sunday, Sep 25, 2005 at 18:43
Hi there... as a person who used to repair speedometers for a living, I can tell you that most speedos are "happy" in that they show you going faster than you are.. assuming you haven't changed tyre size etc. The Ausdtrlain Design Rules call for a speedo accuracy of + or - 10%. Now up here in QLD most speed cameras and general coppers give some leeway from my experience and it's more than 2 kmh.

I was wondering however if we have a barrister in the group as commonwealth law takes precedence over state law and so it would seem to me as a layman that the 2 k over thing could be tested in court.

I have also just come back from 3 weeks in Europe where I drove a Benz Compressor all over the place at 190 plus in some areas and found that the Europeans are not so anal about speed limits on their good roads. For example the motorways in Austria which have a limit of 130 are not as good as QLD's M1 which goes from Brisbane to the Gold Coast with a limit of 110 and speed cameras everywhere. Perhaps it's a hang over from our colonial past that we are so overgoverned.

Mark T

AnswerID: 131723

Reply By: Wombat - Monday, Sep 26, 2005 at 12:36

Monday, Sep 26, 2005 at 12:36
As this is your first (?) traffic offence in this wonderful 'State of Steve Bracks Thought Police' I believe that if you write a nice letter to the authorities explaining that you are, and always have been, a safe, courteous and concientious driver who makes a concerted effort to travel below the posted speed limits, and that this was a one-off error on your behalf you stand a very good chance of having the fine and subsequent demerit point revoked.
AnswerID: 131816

Follow Up By: Al & Mrs Al (Vic) - Monday, Sep 26, 2005 at 12:56

Monday, Sep 26, 2005 at 12:56
Hi Paul

yes that has happened I know of a couple of cases...one being my dad, who as you know is a real speed demon [NOT!] he explained that it was a momentary lack of concentration and it was his first offence in over 50 years of driving and had the fine and points revoked.

cheers

Lyn
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Reply By: Member - Jeff M (WA) - Monday, Sep 26, 2005 at 20:21

Monday, Sep 26, 2005 at 20:21
"$131.00 . Fair is fair, I'll cop it as I deserve it"

No it's not, it's total crap. Wankers.
AnswerID: 131895

Follow Up By: ShnogDog - Monday, Sep 26, 2005 at 21:09

Monday, Sep 26, 2005 at 21:09
I guess I'm saying if thats the law, then I'll cop it. I think its a bloody fine line, and what it has done is taught me to find out a little more about these things when I next venture interstate. "I'll cop it as I deserve it"... is probably poorly worded. I personally feel that varying regulations from one state to the next is a bit ridiculous. There should be a National Standard for these things. Dont get me wrong. I think it is total crap, but if thats the law, I guess I'll have to cop it.
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