Hella Predator Lights - $2500 and they leak like a sieve .
Submitted: Saturday, Oct 08, 2005 at 23:15
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Member - Willie , Epping .Syd.
Howdy ,
I just thought I should save you a heartache by telling you about my misadventure with Hella HID
driving lights .
In June I forked out big money for these lights at Bars N racks at Hornsby in
Sydney . When I ordered them I told the guy at the
shop that they were foir a Landcruiser . I had checked them out on the Hella Australia and Hella NZ websites and there was no mention about them being unsuitable for 4WD use . In fact the NZ site said they were suitable for "the roughest conditions in mining , the transport industry and 4WD vehicles ".
Well folks , I can tell you that that is a straight LIE . They are unsuitable for 4WD vehicles because you get 2 cm of muddy
water in them when you do a
creek crossing and they go under ( even for a few seconds ).
The Hella manager Mr Robert Stevenson , advised me by email " that the Predator lights ....are not designed to be submersed ". Their rep told me that they ARE suitable for 4WDs because 90 % of 4 WDs do not do river crossings .
I told the Hella rep , that the lights should have a warning on the packaging saying that they LEAK and that 4WD stores should advise customers that they LEAK . He would not agree and thought it was OK to sell them without a warning . Nice people eh - only interested in a profit - stuff the consumer .
I just took
mine apart yesterday and cleaned the muddy
water off the reflectors with metho . But hell , dont you have to do that with your $200 lights ???
I had a set of Cibie Oscars for ten years and they went from car to car and through many creeks and rivers - never looked like taking in
water .
So if you want HID lights , FORGET HELLA unless you are certain you will never ford a
creek . I believe that the 4000 series (non HID ) also leak like a sieve as when I was marooned on a property in the
Pilbara ( after 3" in one day ) , it was the station owner who started laughing about putting some goldfish in my Hella lights and explained that the same thing had happened to his 4000 series lights after one brief swim .
Cheers ,
Willie .
Reply By: Andrew (Whyalla SA) - Saturday, Oct 08, 2005 at 23:20
Saturday, Oct 08, 2005 at 23:20
Interesting. Ive had Hella 4000s on my Patrol for nearly 6 years now and they dont leak. Ive done many
water crossings without any issues. The 4000s are the same housings as Predators.
AnswerID:
133704
Follow Up By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 13:15
Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 13:15
Andrew ,
At the back of my Predator housing in the red plastic is an enrtry point for the cable . This is a loose fit and the
water can literally pore in . Then the plug into the actual reflector housing is not a tight fit either .
I did a quick 15 m
creek crossing - the lights had not been on . One light had 3 cm of muddy
water, the other one only had 1.5 cm .
I do not know why yours have not leaked - the property owner who was giving me some stick had the same housing as the Predator as
well .
Cheers ,
Willie .
FollowupID:
387905
Reply By: ShnogDog - Saturday, Oct 08, 2005 at 23:49
Saturday, Oct 08, 2005 at 23:49
Go the Aussie ...
2 words
Light Force
AnswerID:
133708
Follow Up By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 13:16
Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 13:16
I would have purchased the Lightforce at the time , but I was a bit worried that they used a plastic cover to create the spread beam from the pencil beam .
Cheers ,
Willie .
FollowupID:
387906
Follow Up By: andrewr - Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 14:27
Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 14:27
Lightforce HID come with spacers for the bulb which can be used to adjust the beam instead of (or with) spreader covers. I haven't tried them though so I don't know how effective they are.
FollowupID:
387917
Reply By: Member - Davoe (Widgiemooltha) - Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 00:02
Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 00:02
LMAO" the roughest conditions in mining " -
well maybe but I would suggest not to many companys are going to put $2500 lights on their vehicles for joe average worker to smash for them (walls tend to do that)
AnswerID:
133714
Reply By: Bonz (Vic) - Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 07:20
Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 07:20
Willie, it mustve been a pain going thru all this, but one I have been thru before. I was considering Hella 4000's and ended up with LF XGT's, which also annoyingly get condensation behind the covers (not inside the light tho). Also had a problem with them moving on their mounts, emailed LF, DIDN'T EVEN GET A RESPONSE.
The solution was to do them up tighter. FAR tighter than I would normally have done, in fact my mate who was helping kept asking me if I was sure about how tight, even he was worried.
Do you think small claims would assist? Although predator HIDs arent a small claim.
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 13:47
Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 13:47
Hi Bonz ,
I had to email Hella three times , before I got an answer . I think if the lights were designed with the cable going in at the bottom of the unit , it would form a bubble which would not let the
water in . The big problem with these lights is the placement of the cable entry point half way up the back of the light .
Cheers ,
Willie
FollowupID:
387913
Reply By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 08:09
Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 08:09
Wow!! gee they'd wanna be damn good for that money, i can only think that a new bullbar comes with them also.. it must be my scottish genes from way back showing through!!!
AnswerID:
133729
Follow Up By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 13:18
Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 13:18
Michael ,
It's interesting that you mention the bull bar . ARB have advised me that the tabs on their bull bars are not covered by warranty for these heavy lights .
They have had a few claims .
Cheers ,
Willie .
FollowupID:
387907
Follow Up By: Member - 'Lucy' - Monday, Oct 10, 2005 at 00:28
Monday, Oct 10, 2005 at 00:28
Just how heavy are these lights you have got.
I have a brand new ARB bar on my 75 series and I have stood on those tabs just to see how good they are.
Mate! they would hold a 'tonne'.
A little dob of S i l l y - c o n e goes a long way when sealing up lights.
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Monday, Oct 10, 2005 at 11:09
Monday, Oct 10, 2005 at 11:09
"Lucy",
Mine look really strong too , but I bet if you ask ARB they will recommend you get your tabs re-inforced if buying a set of big lights .
Cheers ,
Willie .
FollowupID:
388023
Reply By: Big Kidz (Andrew & Jen) - Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 09:14
Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 09:14
You should be able to get your money back if they are unsuitable. If you told them they are for 4wd use and they know that ten percent of 4wd's do river crossings then they should have made sure they were suitable for you.
Have a look at this ACCC website particularly the bits headlined '
services' and 'goods' on the page that I linked to.
They might swap em over for something that is suitable.
Andrew
AnswerID:
133736
Follow Up By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 13:30
Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 13:30
The Hella manager told me " If you are looking at making river crossings where the lights will be submerged then we do have a light that has been specifically designed for this function called the Hydrolux .
This is not HID , so I would not be interested in any swap .
In his letter he also states " On the surface I would not say the lights are faulty , but to make a clear determination we would need to have the lights back so that we can inspect them ". So he was willing to take them back , and probably would have cleaned or replaced the reflectors as a
sign of his companies great generosity ( read avoidance of a stink ) but they would not take them off for me and it would have cost me $50 to have them removed as the wiring with the ballast thingies is prewtty complicated . I opted to pull the reflectors out and clean them myself .
My complaint is not that they told me to get knotted after the event , because they did not . My complaint is that I was sold them , without any warning that they were unsuitable for use on a 4WD . I was ripped off , and others will likewise be ripped off in the future .
Cheers ,
Willie .
FollowupID:
387908
Follow Up By: Big Kidz (Andrew & Jen) - Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 13:43
Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 13:43
Hi Willie
It is pretty clear what you were expecting is not what you got in that you thought the lights could be submerged but were not told they could not be.
From the ACCC website...."be fit for the purpose—goods must do the job you made clear to the supplier you wanted them to do or that are implied from the circumstances in which you purchased the goods".
If you made it clear to them that you wanted them for four wheel driving and that would imply that they may get wet in river crossings, the I would argue that the 'Goods are NOT doing the job you made clear to the supplier that you wanted them to do' and if that is a given then you are legally entitled to get your money back - you will have to fight for it though! It is irrelevant if the lights are faulty or not. It seems you are not claiming they are faulty... just that they are not fit for the purpose that you expected them to suit.
Andrew
Andrew
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 13:51
Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 13:51
Yes Andrew , you have a good point there . I think I will go for it . Either that or make two waterproof bags to slip over the lights when I do any future crossings .
Cheers ,
Willie .
FollowupID:
387914
Reply By: Peter 2 - Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 10:28
Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 10:28
Willie
With that attitude from Hella I'd be advising them that you will be spreading the word far and wide, if still no response them stick it to them on every website and
forum you can access. companies need to learn that in this day and age us the 'little' people can access thousands and possibly millions of potential customers and spread the word. I'd still be sticking it up them through ACCC, Fair Trading etc as
well.
I'd also be speaking the the manager of the store where you bought them and advise him of what you are about to do too.
Stick it to 'em!!!
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 13:34
Sunday, Oct 09, 2005 at 13:34
Hi Peter ,
If you have a look at my answer above you will see that after the event , they were quite reasonable . It is just that they should never have sold them to me in the first place .
I had to laugh when I saw Hella Predator lights reviewed in an HID light comparision in one of the big 4WD mags this month . Buyer beware .
Cheers ,
Willie .
FollowupID:
387909
Reply By: glenno(qld) - Monday, Oct 10, 2005 at 07:19
Monday, Oct 10, 2005 at 07:19
Next time when you go into a 4wd store to complain about something make sure you wear your exploroz cap . Frightens the s*** out of em. I have no problem getting things fixed.
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Monday, Oct 10, 2005 at 11:12
Monday, Oct 10, 2005 at 11:12
Glenno ,
I don't have a hat and I don't think they would know about the site anyway . I have never seen a car with an Exploroz sticker on it , so I don't think too many people know about it . ( everyone will yell at me for saying that ! )
Willie .
FollowupID:
388024