4WD have a bad name + Harold Scruby

Submitted: Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 17:56
ThreadID: 28577 Views:4397 Replies:26 FollowUps:15
This Thread has been Archived
Hi there,
I've worked for with a recognisable 4WD manufacturer and now am in a gig undertaking research into the perceptions of 4WD's.

Where do you think this negative perception comes from - is it just Harold Scruby? or is the north shore kind of Toorack tractor perception of the vehicles?

Do youthink people really understand what a 4Wd is meant for?

Is there a difference between driving a 4WD in the city and in the outback?

Throw whatever you want at me - opnions, research, articles whatever - I am acompiling a report so I'd love to post your input
Back Expand Un-Read 0 Moderator

Reply By: Lone Wolf - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 18:06

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 18:06
Pretty hard to take you on seriously, when you can't spell, use correct punctuation, and capital letters where lower case should be.

This alone, tells me you aren't what you say you are.

Wolfie
AnswerID: 142160

Reply By: Member - Ian H (NSW) - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 18:17

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 18:17
I had the same thought. If you can not spell how are you going to put together a readable report?
AnswerID: 142161

Reply By: Member - Pezza (QLD) - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 18:27

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 18:27
Yep, thought exactly the same thing, think it might be one of Scruby's dippy mates digging for info to make it easier to fight their silly little war against us by thinking they then know where our weak spots are.

Avagoodn
Pezza
AnswerID: 142162

Follow Up By: old mate - Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 08:13

Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 08:13
You honestly think this is some sort of conspiracy? What piffle!
0
FollowupID: 395817

Reply By: Cowgal - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 18:33

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 18:33
End of a long day.
I said throw whatever you would like at me - you can be part of this or not - it is up to you ...

Lets begin again

I've worked in the automotive industry, I now represent the industry and I am preparing a research report into the perceptions of 4WD's. Here is a sample of the work which has gone to a wide cross section of people including Government Ministers, CEO's of major insurance companies, roads and traffic authorities, lobby groups and high profile journalist. It is usually conducted in a one on one style so that more effective material can be gathered.

1. On scale of 1 to 5, 1 being very low and 5 being very high, please rate your level of concern about the following vehicle and road safety issues?

1.1 Driver fatigue
1.2 Speeding
1.3 Drink driving & drug driving
1.4 Inexperienced drivers (P Platers)
1.5 4WD safety
1.6 Truck driver fatigue
1.7 Mobile phone use whilst driving

2. On a scale of 1 to 5, 1 being strongly disagrees and 5 being strongly agree, rate the following statements:


4.1 4WD’s are safe
4.2 4WDs are unsafe
4.3 4WD’s safety should be better regulated
4.4 Safety is primarily the drivers responsibility
4.5 If a pedestrian is hit by a 4WD they are twice as likely to be killed
4.6 4WDs are safer than other vehicles

3. Thinking about the statements above, what factors help form your opinion of vehicle safety?

4. On a scale of 1 to 5, 1 being strongly disagrees and 5 being strongly agree, rate the following statements:

4WD use more petrol than other vehicles
4WD’s should be banned from urban areas
4WD owners need to undertake a specialised driving skills course
It is the North Shore (Toorack) 4WD drivers who are unsafe

5. Thinking about the statements above, it is often touted that this 4WD safety issue is predominately a ‘North Shore’ (Toorack) problem - what are your thoughts on that?

So ball is in your court - send me your opinions, articles, research or not - just berate me - that is fine - I am only trying to help balance out the Scruby's of this world.

Hi there,
I've worked for with a recognisable 4WD manufacturer and now am in a gig undertaking research into the perceptions of 4WD's.

Where do you think this negative perception comes from - is it just Harold Scruby? or is the north shore kind of Toorack tractor perception of the vehicles?

Do youthink people really understand what a 4Wd is meant for?

Is there a difference between driving a 4WD in the city and in the outback?

Throw whatever you want at me - opnions, research, articles whatever - I am acompiling a report so I'd love to post your input
AnswerID: 142164

Follow Up By: Lone Wolf - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 18:37

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 18:37
Well, I do take my hat off to you for coming back, and not with a vengeance.

You certainly do have a thick skin, and maybe, your heart is in the right place.

I take back some of what I said, and I wish you well in your research.

Ian
0
FollowupID: 395757

Follow Up By: joc45 - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 18:54

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 18:54
If you're doing that sort of survey, wouldn't it be better to give an address for members to submit their views, rather than create an enormously long post here?
And, umm, there are a few states that don't have a North Shore or Toorack (sic). And don't have a Harold Scruby either ;-)
Some questions are a bit ill-worded; eg, petrol question - a lot of 4wds out here are diesel - makes a lot of difference to the answer given, esp if you are after accurate stats.
Gerry
0
FollowupID: 395761

Follow Up By: Exploder - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 20:16

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 20:16
I will respond with words for some.

1.1 Driver fatigue> It’s the same as any other vehicle why is a 4WD more dangerous.

1.2 Speeding> Not a big problem in my book’s, half the roads in this country could do with a speed increase. The government just like getting money from fines, with the amount of car’s on the road and k’s travelled each year the road toll is fairly good. They lower speed limit’s make it harder to get a license police the bleep out of us spend money on adds ECT and has the road toll changed.

1.3 Drink driving & drug driving>4

1.4 Inexperienced drivers (P Platers)> They have to learn some time, You what to teach P platers to drive get them on a ball bearing gravel road’s in a rear wheel drive car, 6cyl or above, You teach people to drive at speed on those types of roads at a young age you will have a country of A1 drivers who can handle a car. You don’t learn how to control a car putting around with a driving instructor or on a Computer.

1.4 4WD safety> ?? I didn’t by my 4Wd for safety I brought it so I could go to out of the way placers and explore the bush! As for if a small car and a 4WD have a crash of corse the small car will come out worse it’s basic Physics, and if this is a persons sole resin for hating 4WD’s well I am sorry but they are a dip bleep .

1.5 Truck driver fatigue>2
1.6 Mobile phone use whilst driving>2

. On a scale of 1 to 5, 1 being strongly disagrees and 5 being strongly agree, rate the following statements:

4.1 4WD’s are safe, If you are buying a 4WD just because you think it is the safest you are buying for the wrong resins, their are plenty of cars that are safer than a 4WD.

4.2 4WDs are unsafe, Compleat bleep , I can name 4 of my friend’s who would be dead now if they weren’t in a 4WD, and offcourse a 4WD will implement more damage to a smaller car so why should this make a small car safe and a 4WD dangerous. More to the point any car is unsafe when driven badly.

4.3 4WD’s safety should be better regulated>1
4.4 Safety is primarily the drivers responsibility> a big 5
4.5 If a pedestrian is hit by a 4WD they are twice as likely to be killed> If any car hit’s you at speed you will be dead or seriously injured, tell me how many people have been killed by being hit by a 4WD this year, Now tell me how many 4WD were involved in animal strikes I.E Cow, Roo, Emu, Goat and how many of those people would be dead or injured if they were not in a 4WD.

4.6 4WDs are safer than other vehicles> depends what Vehicles and under what conditions. I have a mate who was recently involved in a LEGAL Drag racing accident where the front left side of the car hit the wall at 160km/h in his street legal Supercharged Commodore now if we believe all the Government adds he should be Dead so why did he walk away with only a bruised nee and well a written off car.
I also know someone who hit a Cow head on wile travelling at 110km/h at night in the country and if he wasn’t in a 4WD he would be Dead if this was a commodore or a small car he would have been dead. Get were I am going with this?

3. Thinking about the statements above, what factors help form your opinion of vehicle safety?, I will be honest I have never even looked at the safety rating on a vehicle when buying, I buy what will best suet my need’s and the vehicle I Like.

4. On a scale of 1 to 5, 1 being strongly disagrees and 5 being strongly agree, rate the following statements:

4WD use more petrol than other vehicles> Ever driven a Turbo diesel Nissan, Toyota, Jeep or even a ford F250 you will be impressed. My 4.0Ltr V6 4WD (Petrol engine) uses around 14Ltrs per 100k’s driving around the metro aria. My Mum’s 2.2ltr Honda gets around 10ltrs per 100k’s around the metro aria, and I can go a lot of places the Honda can’t go and carry a lot more equipment and people in comfort as well.

4WD’s should be banned from urban areas 1
4WD owners need to undertake a specialised driving skills course> Should be a option if a first time buyer
It is the North Shore (Toorack) 4WD drivers who are unsafe> Don’t know don’t life there.

They are my opinions like it or hate it.
0
FollowupID: 395766

Reply By: Member - Jack - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 18:40

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 18:40
It will be a massive thread if you want us to repond here ... got an email address we can send this off to?
Jack
The hurrieder I go, the behinder I get. (Lewis Carroll-Alice In Wonderland)

Member
My Profile  My Position  Send Message

AnswerID: 142165

Reply By: Footloose - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 19:25

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 19:25
Diving right on in.........
What is the aim of your report ? What are your other data sources? What are the likely outcomes of this report ?
What sort of stakeholder are you in this report ? What qualifications/experience do you have in this area ?
...........................
Possibly 17 million of our population live in cities I'm told. City dwellers are not necessarily aware of the useage of 4wds by non farmers.
Many 4wds are big (hard to get round and speed), because they're big then they must use more fuel (not true empirically) and emit more "greenhouse gas". (They've never stood behind a cow!). They can't see behind themselves (vision in most is better than many cars) and if they hit me in my smartcar then I die not them. (not fair). They cost more than a second hand Holden and the rich buggars can buy them because the tariff is ls less (than what ?). They ruin the air, they ruin my driving pleasure, I can't afford one, and the pedestal council rekkons they're unsafe. Gotta have something to whinge about while I gulp my sandwhich down in Martin Place eh ? Gotta be po liti cally and environ mental ly correct ? See; there's another article in the paper and its just what I said (as if that turns the world).
No 4wds in cities I rekkon. What's that ? You want to restrict my holiday choices ? Buggar off !
I'm sure there's a bit of accurate city dweller perception in there somewhere.

Fuelled by what ? The media? Tick. Harold media sl*t Scooby Do ? Tick. The explosion in numbers of them on the road ? Tick. That big shiny one in my rich neighbours garage ? Tick. It's cool to criticize them ? Tick. They make a great excuse to vent my shortcomings on the road ? Tick.

"Is there a difference between driving a 4WD in the city and in the outback? " What sort of question is that to ask in this forum? Can you be just a tad more specific ? What sorts of difference are we looking at ? Outside of a city they are almost the difference between walking and driving. Without them you don't get far if it rains etc. And that's on our "roads". Most people here are serious 4wd people. That means that they travel far from the Martin Place Mob madness. To get there they need a 4wd. I know that this is probably new to you but most of Australia is empty space, to get anywhere you can't walk or take public transport. And although from point A to point B might be 4000K, there usually isn't a road as city dwellers know them. It takes a big (forget motels and garages, you have to carry everything !) tough (a normal car would be shaken apart ) vehicle to get there and back in 1 piece. And we haven't even touched on main hazards of the tracks.

Bullbars ? Now don't get me going ............:))

AnswerID: 142169

Follow Up By: Exploder - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 20:34

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 20:34
Good one.LOL

Will there be a part 2.
0
FollowupID: 395767

Follow Up By: Footloose - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 20:46

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 20:46
Mate, I rekkon I should of stopped and waited for his answers at the firsdt line of dots......... I could then have adopted a clinically academic approach, instead of trying in inject some humour into what the 4th estate sees as a life and death struggle between fat hairy 4wd owners and po litically and environmentally correct would be if I could be wannabee pushbike riders.
Oh sorry. Am I being a bit biased here ? Thast was the newspaper on the phone, they want me to do a story .............:)))))))))
0
FollowupID: 395770

Reply By: Motherhen - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 20:39

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 20:39
Cowgal give us an email address and i will respond. I don't want to bore everyone here, and as has already been said. it will be too long a thread, and not relevant to the purposes of the forum at this stage. There would be a lot of repetition, so the thread will get monotonous.

Better still from your point of view would be an interactive website - one of those tick the boxes PLUS endless room for comments. Much easier to collate, and statistics like that can be used in your report as they are substantiated. Various comments from forum members is harder to collate, not as clear and precise, therefore not a provable or even useful statistic for you study. I cannot see that research carried out using opinions gathered from the forum would be accepted by any organisation/body/government. You have not said who you are working for - yourself? I can see why your first post was not taken seriously.

By all means let us see a summary of your results. Road safety has always been a major concern of mine. A farmers, my family spend a lot of time on the road, almost all of it in 4WDs.

Who the **** is Harold Scruby does anyone care?

Motherhen

Red desert dreaming

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  Send Message

AnswerID: 142175

Follow Up By: Footloose - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 20:51

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 20:51
Scruby ?... noun...look under pedestal council..look under media mistress....look under "I drive a 4wd and my wife can't park it"....look under I vant to be a politician (again).....look under bullbar....oops that last one wasn't nice Footy !!!!!
0
FollowupID: 395772

Follow Up By: Footloose - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 21:17

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 21:17
For more see WHO ??</a
0
FollowupID: 395775

Follow Up By: Footloose - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 21:18

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 21:18
Sorry, try http://home.iprimus.com.au/jimshire/mr_who.htm
0
FollowupID: 395776

Reply By: Member - Ian W (NSW) - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 20:48

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 20:48
Cowgal,

Nice comeback after a very shaky start - Congrats on that.

HOWEVER!

If you are serious about your survey and if you have no hidden agenda then how bout being totally upfront?

Who are you?

Exactly who do you represent? etc:, etc:, etc:

Sorry if I sound a little cynical but you are still more more than a little vague about where you wish to take this exercise

Ian
AnswerID: 142178

Reply By: Member - Oldplodder (QLD) - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 21:13

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 21:13
I think you need to add more detail to the term '4wd' in this survey.

Your answer will assist me in answering your survey, in particular the 1 to 5 grading of anwers.

I prefer not to give my definition first, as it will influence your answer.
AnswerID: 142180

Reply By: BorisK - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 21:16

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 21:16
Cowgal are you a year 7 or 8 student by any chance?
AnswerID: 142182

Reply By: Old Nick - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 21:37

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 21:37
Give us an email address,or option two, change your name to CLOWNGAL!!
AnswerID: 142185

Reply By: Brian B (QLD) - Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 22:15

Friday, Dec 02, 2005 at 22:15
Hi Cowgal,

As some of the other replies have said, I think you will need to be up front with who you represent etc as people blindly answering surveys has an annoying habit of coming back to haunt them later on.

I don't think random email surveys add a lot of credibility to the task at hand.

AnswerID: 142188

Reply By: Trekkie - Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 00:09

Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 00:09
My My aren't we a touchy lot - lil ole Cow Gal gets on OUR forum and asks us a question and look at the defensive results she got. Even when she comes straight back, we still question her - I say what does it matter who she represents or even if she is a 7th grade student or even Harold's wife.

I thought this would be our opportunity to tell her as we see it (and that could be seen as right or wrong - good or bad - by the majority of road users -who cares) Personally I probably will not particpate, but I was surprised at the reaction she got.

If we react like that to all road users !!! ....... but I am sure we dont, maybe we are just a little sick of being attacked by a vocal minority and some idiot journos who probably dont know a turbo from a dip stick ... now I am getting wound up so I will just hit the Submit Reply button and go back to looking on ebay for a cat
AnswerID: 142198

Follow Up By: Motherhen - Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 00:46

Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 00:46
Hi Trekkie - I am sure many of us would give Cowgal feedback if she gives us a website or email addy. Research conducted in the manner proposed on the forum would have no clout, and anyone involved in research would know this. I have come back to the post to check for a bit more info and that web or email address - but no more Cowgal. Before responding, I, like others on the post would like to know more about this Cowgal doing research for some nebulous unclarified group.
!MPG:9!
Motherhen

Red desert dreaming

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 395799

Reply By: muzzgit (WA) - Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 02:28

Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 02:28
Haven't you guys figured it out....cowgal IS harold screwbey.

AnswerID: 142204

Reply By: V8Diesel - Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 09:19

Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 09:19
Hi there, got stuff to do so I won't answer all your questions but here's my Readers Digest condensed version in point form..............

1. I could not earn my living without a 4WD. I also view it as a safety factor with solo travel in often remote places.

2. I've walked away from two serious collisions (both not my fault BTW) and firmly believe I'd be in a real mess if I hadn't been travelling in a full-size commercial vehicle. You cannae change the laws of physics.

3. Lifestyle benefits. This morning I'm heading off with some good friends to go 4WD'ing and BBQ'ing in some beautiful countryside that the general public would find very hard to get to for some peace & quiet after a very heavy week of work. If I wanted to sit shoulder to shoulder with a thousand other picnickers (?) I'd go to Kings Park like everyone else.

4. My petrol 100 series when running on LPG is cheaper to operate than my wife's passenger car and its exhaust emmissions are significantly more environmentally friendly to boot. My diesel V8 75 series frequently returns better fuel economy than many popular passenger vehicles.

5. I expect both my vehicles will be running efficiently in another 20 years time whereas most cheaply constructed cars would only be fit for the scrap heap.

6. I just like it. I can have more fun at 1km/h crawling up a hill than at speed on the bitumen.

Hope this helps.

AnswerID: 142224

Reply By: Sand Man (SA) - Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 09:24

Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 09:24
Different Tack,

I'm not going to "rate" my perception of 4WD vehicles because I am biased.
I Love my 4WD and the flexibility it provides for me to travel just about anywhere I wish. I understand its own particular "limitations" and drive accordingly.

There are probably more 4WD owners/drivers that never take their vehicles off road to the extent that most of us do. Probably don't even use 4WD.

These are the people most likely to get themselves into difficulty with their vehicle because they don't have experience in driving their vehicles "off road" and learn to recognise and appreciate any limitations ANY vehicle may have. And these are also the people, in the main, that may project a negative image of what a Four Wheel Drive vehicle is, what it can do and what it (or the driver) can't do.

And Harold (who?).......He doesn't even count. I put him in the same category as Ray Martin and colleagues.

Bill


I'm diagonally parked in a parallel Universe!

Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

AnswerID: 142226

Reply By: Graham- Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 09:32

Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 09:32
Cowgal said: "Here is a sample of the work which has gone to a wide cross section of people including Government Ministers, CEO's of major insurance companies, roads and traffic authorities, lobby groups and high profile journalist"

Bzzzzz - Government Ministers, and members of parliament for that matter, do not, repeat, do not, complete surveys like this under any circumstances!

To state this is the case is, quite simply, a fabrication!

It may have gone out to them, they did not get a completed survey back!

Regards

Graham
AnswerID: 142227

Reply By: Flash - Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 11:56

Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 11:56
I go along with the line that even if Cowgal is Harold's wife (poor girl!) then what harm does it do to tell her.....
BTW We have four cars in this family.... of six people, five drivers licences.
Two are 1.4litre fours.
One is a 1.8 litre four.
One is a 4.2 litre turbodiesel 4WD, with a large bull bar, lots of heavy towing and 4WD gear. That's basically all it does- 4WDing and towing.
Now if I have a gripe it is why doesn't the government have "transferable" rego so more people could afford to leave the 4WD in the garage during the week and have a cheap "enviromentally friendly" little car for dropping off the kids and commuting. I do that, but it's an expensive exercise due to the "fixed" costs like rego and insurance. (I don't really care much about depreciation as we hold on to our cars for a long time, eg: my 4WD, bought new, is about to hit sixteen years old, and one of the 4cyl cars is nearly 25 years young.)
Give us an email address for the rest Cowgal.
Cheers
AnswerID: 142237

Reply By: GaryInOz (Vic) - Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 15:59

Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 15:59
My 2c worth????

Our bad rap stems from the "mum's taxi" and "shopping centre gymkhana" ppl. Basicallyit is the ppl that have them as trophy vehicles to try to assert status on themselves that are our main source of bad reputation for lousy driving skills.

The irony is that the ppl that say 4WD's are dangerous are the husbands/wives of those ppl that do the shopping in them, or pick up the kids from school.

As a general observation (living in very close proximity to a major shopping ctr in Melb) the drivers have no concept of the length and width of their vehicles and cannot park or manoever them with any degree of accuracy. My guess would be that the majority of accidents reported to the insurance co's would be low speed fender-benders by ppl with low levels of driving skills and high levels of distractions (kids, talking, looking for parking spot, etc.)

I think the level of reported "off-road" incidents to the insurers would be numerically significantly lower, but of higher repair cost.

Most of us accept that a bit of rock rash is an inevitable part of our pastime, and would seldom report it to our insurer, choosing to privately repair it ourselves, unless it was a disabling kind of damage.

Most ppl that use their 4WD for recreation have good driving skills, which are needed to minimize damage and operate safely. They tend to be more in tune with their vehicle and its characteristics.

Now if we could get the manufacturers of the so-called "crossover" vehicles to give REALISTIC representations of the capacity of their vehicles in their advertising.............
AnswerID: 142257

Reply By: Motherhen - Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 16:58

Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 16:58
Cowgal - you've certainly got everyone's interest - look at the number of people who have read this post! Then you disappeared. Where are you?
Motherhen

Red desert dreaming

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  Send Message

AnswerID: 142264

Follow Up By: Mr Fawlty - Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 18:44

Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 18:44
Probably gone off to regroup... or log in under another name....maybe even decided that the "statistics" he/she wanted were not going to favour his/her agenda so we have been abandoned...I'm kind of amazed because the "Government" never gets it's stats / data by interviewing a known vested interest....Especially as the only agenda of any goverment is to increase motoring costs....
0
FollowupID: 395850

Reply By: Member - Bill F (VIC) - Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 21:40

Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 21:40
Hi Cowgal,

Can you give a definition of a 4wd that suits you research?

Bill

also check 4wd polli
AnswerID: 142291

Reply By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 22:35

Saturday, Dec 03, 2005 at 22:35
TROL
AnswerID: 142301

Reply By: Trekkie - Sunday, Dec 04, 2005 at 02:50

Sunday, Dec 04, 2005 at 02:50
I think I have figured it out

Cowgal is actually Willem
AnswerID: 142315

Follow Up By: Motherhen - Sunday, Dec 04, 2005 at 14:56

Sunday, Dec 04, 2005 at 14:56
Willem - is that you with your finger on the trigger?

!MPG:10!
Motherhen

Red desert dreaming

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 395896

Follow Up By: Motherhen - Sunday, Dec 04, 2005 at 14:57

Sunday, Dec 04, 2005 at 14:57
Oops - what happened to the picture i posted?
!MPG:10!
Motherhen

Red desert dreaming

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 395897

Follow Up By: Motherhen - Sunday, Dec 04, 2005 at 14:58

Sunday, Dec 04, 2005 at 14:58
I give up - this website deletes anything to do with cats
!MPG:10!
Motherhen

Red desert dreaming

Lifetime Member
My Profile  My Blog  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 395898

Reply By: Cowgal - Monday, Dec 05, 2005 at 08:35

Monday, Dec 05, 2005 at 08:35
Thank you very much for your input. Part of the reason the questiosn seem to be a bit east coast centric- is that is where the media firestorm on four wheel drives is usually generated.

email address for further submission
fourwheeldrivesurvey@hotmail.com
AnswerID: 142430

Follow Up By: Member - Tonester (VIC) - Monday, Dec 05, 2005 at 10:00

Monday, Dec 05, 2005 at 10:00
or email thisweekstattslottoresults@hotmail.com. Seriously, fair dinkum.
0
FollowupID: 395962

Reply By: Member - Oldplodder (QLD) - Monday, Dec 05, 2005 at 10:01

Monday, Dec 05, 2005 at 10:01
Cowgal,

You didn't get back to me with your definition of a 4wd.

First, these are my views, and therefore can only be quoted in part of full with my permission. Contact me at auscadatgildotcomdotau.

I don't think this discussion that the media is pushing is a 4wd versus others, or others versus 4wd discussion. That is why most 4wd drivers won't give you a definite answer, they see a bigger picture. Not the narrow one that is almost darwinian in nature by trying to break up modes of transport into good and bad, and trying to push the demise of one type of transport by portraying it as floundering for survival, in this case a rampant elephant in surburbia. Elephants are one of the most gentle and cautious creatures I know.

Looking at the issues you raised, it is really is the mind set of the driver, whether it is a large 4wd , small 4wd, all wheel drive, large 2wd, or small 2wd, or motor bike.

Safety is also a driver/pedestrian mindest. I had to do a very quick stop the other day because a pedestrain stepped off the kerb in front of me at some pedestrain lights. They had a red don't walk and I had a green light. I pulled up in time. I don't think they saw me and decided to cross against the red. As a pedestrian I always wait for the 'walk' sign, even though others cross against the 'don't walk'.

I don't drive or think any differently when I drive the 74 bettle or the newer 1.8l golf in the family.
Our family of four drivers car pool the cars in the family. Son needed to move furniture for a friend, so he took the Pajero. Pajero is good for carrying 7 people too instead of taking 2 cars (used to be good for running 5 kids to school in our parents car pool). If just one or two of us, we often take a smaller car.

Have travelled (for business and pleasure) around most of eastern and central australia in the Pajero. A 2wd car would have been a lot riskier from a mechanical point of view with ground clearance and protection of the underside like sumps and fuel tanks.

Pajero gets about the same economy as a commodore or Falcon, and will last twice as long, therefore the total environmetal cost of the lifecycle of the vehicle is most probably less. The 86 pajero has more kilometres on the dial than the 74 beetle or 78 golf. The golf and beetle are on thier 2nd engines, Pajero still going strong on it's first. After all, the largest 'car' on the road, and least effecient is a 2wd.

Look forward to hearing from you, and seeing the results of your survey.
AnswerID: 142436

Reply By: Truckster (Vic) - Monday, Dec 05, 2005 at 10:09

Monday, Dec 05, 2005 at 10:09
smells like c o w s h i t to me.

And how pathetic, trying with a HOTMAIL address? FFS..
AnswerID: 142438

Sponsored Links

Popular Products (9)