Alcohol on the Cape-BUSTED!!
Submitted: Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 13:21
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TroopyTracker
G'day there,
You see the signs, fines of $37k and wonder if anyone actually ever gets done. Some friends we met on the OTL justed emailed me and they say they stopped and asked for directions in a small town, were asked if carrying anything illegal. They said no just afew midstrengths. They are now stuck for two weeks awaiting court appearance and to gain criminal record for 4 (four) cans of mid strength beer.
Rules are rules I suppose, but thought people would be interested to hear that it does happen so be carefull!!
Matt
Reply By: Truckster (Vic) - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 13:27
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 13:27
pure manure laws them.... unbelieveable, and great for tourism...
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Follow Up By: PK Eildon (VIC) - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 16:34
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 16:34
Think I would like name of court & date. Like to hear other side of story. Sounds a bit sus to me.
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Follow Up By: Ray Bates - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 17:46
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 17:46
I came to Aus thinking that this was a "free country" Why does one section of the community have more rites than the other? Isn't that racial discrimination?
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:20
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:20
yep ..but them their are the rules
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Reply By: fisho64 - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 13:28
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 13:28
I thought if they were pleading guilty they wouldnt have to stay and wait?
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Follow Up By: TroopyTracker - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 13:53
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 13:53
Apparently not???
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Reply By: jennifer78 - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 13:32
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 13:32
where are the boundaries where the no alcohol law kicks in - we will be heading that way early next year and I am sure that my husband will have alcohol on board!!
Jen
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Follow Up By: TroopyTracker - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 13:52
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 13:52
All the info centres have the brochures-about 15 of them I think!? I did see a copy of a map though that was pretty clear for the cape region.
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Reply By: Redeye - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 14:16
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 14:16
Interesting law,
You can only have 1 slab of lite beer and 2 litres of wine in a vehicle but can store as much at home (
camp) as you wish.
There are signs all the way up and brochures at most points we stopped at with maps showing the restricted areas.
Maybe it would have been better to skull the 4 tinnies and risk drink driving.
Redeye
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Reply By: Peter McG (Member, Melbourne) - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 14:21
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 14:21
Which town? We were up there in August and thought the information and instructions were very clear. Totally dry towns which are rare. We stashed our supplies outside the restrcited area and picked it up on the way back.
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Follow Up By: TroopyTracker - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 15:11
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 15:11
Peter,
I've told them about this thread so I'll leave it to them to comment if they choose too. Don't want to get them in anymore trouble.
I know what you're saying and the signs were about. Having said that, not everyone is going to study the map to work out if they will be passing through any dry towns, or perhaps a change of itinery/track closure might cause you to stumble through one of these townships. Could easliy happen. Pretty annoying to loose 2 weeks out of a 3 month trip though. Guess they'll be experts on the region they're stuck in at least???
Matt
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Reply By: nissnut - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 14:50
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 14:50
Hope you werent carrying any petrol or tube repair glue. or for that matter any aerisol cans. The locals would have thought it was xmas. And to think, my taxes are helping to support these people and their siily laws...........nissnut.
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Reply By: Member - andrew B (Kununurra) - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 15:05
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 15:05
While I sort of understand the need for some of these laws, bootlegging 4 cans of midstreangth is hardly going to buy the beachouse! surely commonsense should be th.........oh thats right, commonsense is not to common these days, in some
places, its as illegal as alcohol.
When we went through
Kalumburu a few months back, we had about 200 beers and 2 bottles of rum. Didn't bring any home, and didn't sell any either. Its illegal in the township, but not at honeymoon. Thankfully there is a bit of commonsense still there, if its not on display, its OK.
Cheers Andrew
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Reply By: Member - Glenn D (NSW) - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 16:34
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 16:34
Hows it going Matt,
Almost did the same on the way up the cape in 04 , we stopped for a night half way up the OTL track and sorted it out .
At Sesia then you could buy mid strength or light beer , but they also sold normal wine , the result was that the locals just drank the wine . I think it was fairly expensive from memory , perhaps as a deterrent.
I was speaking to the guy in the tourist info place while we were there and was told the alcohol laws were made after the local ban was in place and guys were rocking up with a truck full of full strength cases and flogging them off locally , at a large profit of course .
As mentioned earlier the town they must have stopped at must have been fully dry .
Hope common sense prevails .
Glenn.
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Reply By: bigcol - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 16:34
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 16:34
They should have been ok with Mid-Strength as far as i knew and i was up there with Redeye that you were permitted 9L of Mid or Light beer and a cask of Red and a cask of white non fortified wine.
We were buying a carton of XXXX Gold every day while at
Bamaga.
The problem I think they might have is some communities have a Zero alcohol limit.
These laws are ridiculous for obvious travellers and holiday makers.
I could have walked into the
Bamaga Tavern and ordered as much full strenght Beer, Rum , Bourbon and Scotch as i could drink provided i drank it in the Tavern.
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Reply By: Sand Man (SA) - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 16:40
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 16:40
Well F**k them, I won't go near the place.
Plenty of other
places in Oz for a social drinker to visit.
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Follow Up By: Sarg - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 18:14
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 18:14
My thoughts exactly!! If I can't have a drink in my country where & when I like, I don't want to be there.
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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 18:26
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 18:26
Yup, I agree.. bleep em.
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Follow Up By: D-Jack - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 20:03
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 20:03
Hey Sandman, been anywhere in
Adelaide (apart from licenced prems) lately???!!!!:) Bit hard to stay out of
Adelaide!
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Follow Up By: stano - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 20:34
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 20:34
Sarg,
There are a few
places I know of where you are not allowed to drink in public
places - try the Surf Coast Shire around the Great Ocean Rd. area - which many people are happy to visit. Do you really mean what your write? Alcohol is a very regulated drug. When Hewitt won the US Open in New
York some time back he couldn't have a drink to celebrate because he was not 21
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 07:54
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 07:54
ditto Sand Man
Stano..this is not the usa
And having alcohol in ones possesion ie the 4wd does not mean your going to drink it in a alcohol free site.
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Follow Up By: V8Diesel - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 10:38
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 10:38
Well said.
Common sense would be the order of the day here, obviously old constable plod is too much of meathead to possess any.
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Follow Up By: Mad Dog - Vic - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 17:57
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 17:57
Yeah farrkk them, I agree.
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:23
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:23
hell i've heard that before
is that you graham?...
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Follow Up By: Mad Dog - Vic - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 19:38
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 19:38
Let me have a look, no I don't look like Graham so I guess not.
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Reply By: Hairy - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 17:06
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 17:06
Luck if they only lose 2 weeks out of their holiday!
In the NT you can lose everything, including your car!
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Follow Up By: David from David and Justine Olsen's 4WD Tag-Along - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 18:06
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 18:06
But only if the Feds get ya. My understanding is the local police can't enforce it. At least those were the words of a police officer. BTW I wouldn't carry any in a dry town, just making the observation.
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Follow Up By: handy - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 18:32
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 18:32
david your welcome to come out my way and find out.
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Follow Up By: David from David and Justine Olsen's 4WD Tag-Along - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 20:35
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 20:35
Handy,
Where is out your way, probably already been there :-)
David
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Follow Up By: handy - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 06:52
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 06:52
david i am out at hermannsburg nt, if you think that the local cops cant enforce it
your in for a big shock.
most of the communities out here are the same. cheers
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Follow Up By: David from David and Justine Olsen's 4WD Tag-Along - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 07:23
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 07:23
Handy
Thanks for your advice. I hoped I made it clear that it wasn't what I thought, it was advice I got from the NT police. The words from a cop from Kalkarinji. " The communities make the laws, we have no jurisdiction to enforce them". "The only police that can enforce them are the Feds"
I have not looked into who's jurisdiction it is. I took his word for it. I follow the rules and ensure all my customers do to, so I don;t need to know who can't arrest me. :-)
David
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Follow Up By: handy - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 07:51
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 07:51
the local often have breath testing just out of town here and always ask are you carrying any grog.
i have seen the evidence down the tip that has been confiscated.
unopened VB and wine casks full of bullet holes. enough to make me cry. cheers
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:24
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:24
David....its not Federal land? so why cant the local constabulary pinch you?
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Follow Up By: David from David and Justine Olsen's 4WD Tag-Along - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:28
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:28
As I said, I am only going by what the cop said, so I can;t really answer you question with any authority. As I understand it, it is about jurisdiction which as nothing to do with the land, and all to do with who has the authority to enforce a particular law.
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:39
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:39
but that ( and all of this) sounds suss
we need more clarification eh?
can the local coppers enforce fed laws?
does it have to be on fed land
etc etc?
or can local cops enforce fed law no matter where?
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Reply By: Larry01 - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 21:48
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 21:48
Apparently the QLD government plane and "staff "appear exempt for these laws. I seem to remember a little issue with a bottle of wine and a government plane. Maybe that should be used as case law in the defence. The alleged of wine would have more standard drinks than 4 midies
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Reply By: Member - Steve (ACT) - Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 22:53
Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 at 22:53
Sandy not Steve!! (have decided I will have to join as a visitor for my little rants)
Don't have a problem with the restrictions or dry areas, whether it works or not, better to be trying to solve a problem than hide your head in the sand and say there isn't one! I think if someone can't go a day or two with out alcohol then perhaps they have the problem! (Just wait a sec while I take cover!)
Without knowing all the facts, I would think that there has to be a better way of dealing with tourists, not that we should be allowed a free for all on alcohol.
We've just returned from CY and camped for a night at Cooks Hut Camp, we did a drive into Lockhart River and while we remembered to empty our car of alcohol, I'm not sure all in our group did! With our fridges mounted in our cars it's easy to forget exactly what you're carrying when you've set up camp and then head off for a drive to explore the area. Could have easily been caught up in a similar situation.
Not sure what the solution is, but I guess just try and be aware of where you are and what you're carrying, and don't rely on the person selling the alcohol to you to know what the rules are! We bought alcohol after checking with the supplier, only to end up leaving a stash
on the road side to collect later once we realised that we had to drive through a town with restrictions to get to our campsite!
Like many others on this
forum I'd be interested to hear how this all pans out!
Sandy
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 07:58
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 07:58
"I think if someone can't go a day or two with out alcohol then perhaps they have the problem".....I must have a big problem...and its NONE OF YOUR f***ing BUSINESS!!!
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Follow Up By: Member - Steve (ACT) - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 08:37
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 08:37
Charming!! Problem noted!
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 08:48
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 08:48
:)
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Follow Up By: Member - Ivan (ACT) - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 09:20
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 09:20
Go get an aspro mate - this is a
forum - no need to be so sensitive!
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 09:35
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 09:35
who are you talking to Ivan
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Follow Up By: Member - Ivan (ACT) - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 09:40
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 09:40
Sorry - should have made it clearer... You mate.
Sandy was stating an opinion and she is entitled to that - am sure she would have been quite happy for you to differ - but your response was over the top ..
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Follow Up By: Member - Steve (ACT) - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 10:03
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 10:03
I like nothing better than a good debate, and value the freedom of speech we have in this country!
I think it a shame when a discussion/debate/topic starts to degenerate into yelling profanity for eg. "NONE OF YOUR f***ing BUSINESS!!!" and takes away from the points being made, gets peoples backs up and the original debate/topic gets lost.
Always happy for someone to disagree, how boring the world would be if we were all the same! Just make it constructive and not destructive to the topic at hand!
Sandy
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 10:18
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 10:18
Sandy I have no idea as to your gender...but regardless of which it is I refer you to "and takes away from the points being made"
what does your opinion "I think if someone can't go a day or two with out alcohol then perhaps they have the problem" has to do with the subject may I ask....
your percieved assumption that some one has a problem (as you put it) has nothing to do with carrying alcohol thru restricted zones
And steve...no it wasnt over the top...its your opinion to see it that way tho
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Follow Up By: Member - Steve (ACT) - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 10:48
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 10:48
"I think if someone can't go a day or two with out alcohol then perhaps they have the problem" I feel was relevant to previous comments on this thread regarding peoples rights to drink where ever they wanted.
I go on 4wd trips with great friends to see fantastic parts of this country, and although we do enjoy a social drink around the campfire at night (and yes some times too many) this isn't the reason went to the Cape. I was surprised that people felt so strongly about not being able to drink at all in a few
places.
"your perceived assumption that some one has a problem (as you put it) has nothing to do with carrying alcohol thru restricted zones" I didn't actually presume anyone had a problem, I probably should have explained my point better that "perhaps" the problem some had with the restrictions was their inability to go a day or two without alcohol.
Hopefully we're now over that one paragraph in my original reply, and I look forward to seeing what the outcome of the original post is!
Sandy (female last time I looked)
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 11:17
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 11:17
"I didn't actually presume anyone had a problem"...you didnt?...but you say type that!...
and again you say it "the problem some had with the restrictions was their inability to go a day or two without alcohol" note the words inability to go without etc etc...and your not saying someone has a problem with alcohol if they cant go a day or two without it???...
gets me what your trying to say..must be something wrong with the way interept what your typing....
bet your glad you dont have a beer belly eh?..otherwise you wouldnt be able to tell..hehehe
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Follow Up By: Member - Steve (ACT) - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 11:24
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 11:24
Yea yea yea yea, applause applause!! There you go, you win and I default through boredom!
Back to the original post
But as before will watch the rest of the post in interest, we're planning on doing CY again in a few years and we were pretty careful this time, but can think of two occasions we could have found ourselves in this situation.
Sandy (soon to have my own name on here, so my poor husband can have his back!!!)
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 17:56
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 17:56
I didnt win anything Sandy....you had lost the whole meaning & purpose of the original post when you put your two bobs worth in by inferring persons who could not let a few days go past with out having to be able to have a drink must have a problem...and i replied cos i didn't approve of your insinuation
Glad to see you have now returned and replied to the purpose of the post.
as i have indicated elsewhere in this post..i reckon it stinks that one can not even carry alcohol in their cars thru sensitive areas...its obviously a stupid law going by some of the replies wherein some are saying you can buy it and drink it in licensed premises. Dont get me wrong...i agree with some areas being alcohol free...but a camp site where you are the only persons around really public?...
Kindest regards
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Follow Up By: Sand Man (SA) - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:39
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:39
Sandy,
I have no problem whatsoever if I am unable to consume alcohol in a restricted area. But to get done for transporting it in your vehicle (carrying) whilst traversing between point A and point C, via point b, is just plain stupidity. That is 1700's stuff.
Which means one has to drink it beforehand, "bury" it until you come back, (what do you do at your destination (point C) where possession and consumption is allowed?) or, what I would expect most sane people would do, leave it stored in your vehicle or camper, out of site of those "people" who would otherwise break in to steal it.
It's just one of those instances where a "local law" is introduced to protect a minority group from themselves, because they don't have the willpower, or commonsense to resist the temptation. As I said above, my solution is not to bother going through, or to, these
places.
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:54
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:54
IMHO sandy jumped to conclusions...let her be heard...but not without argument
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Follow Up By: Member - Steve (ACT) - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:55
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:55
Absolutely agree with you, if you look my original reply we've just come back from CY recently and found ourselves having to stash alcohol that we had with us and looking back I can think of two occasions we were lucky no one asked.
Unfortunately we have little choice but to obey they laws if we want to visit this area, I would rather there be some sort of a consumption law in the dry areas, stiff penalties for buying alcohol for others on the sly sort of thing. I think they would find most would follow the laws and still have the same impact as the current ones but friendlier for tourists!
Interesting to see where this goes!
And yeah it's a bummer not being able to have a drink around the fire, but not a huge issue!
Sandy
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Reply By: Member No 1- Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 08:01
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 08:01
why do they need to stay?
are they under arrest?....or do they want to stay so that they can put the case forward?
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Follow Up By: D-Jack - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:13
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:13
I was just thinking the same thing. Sounds really strange to me. I'm sure a trial for a court case takes a hell of a lot longer than 2 weeks to set, and if they were bailed they would be allowed to leave, otherwise they would be on equivalent of home detention in their camper! Something not right and hope they can sus out this thread and set us all straight. The problem with 'I have a friend' experiences.
D-Jack
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:19
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:19
in any event they dont need to stay...they can always return later if they need to fight it....and in which case they can ask for an adjournment to a later date allowing them to get their facts!
else they are guilty and to which they can reply via post i expect or the very least other representative such as their lawyer
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Reply By: Sand Man (SA) - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:49
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 18:49
Whilst we are on this subject, may I move slightly off topic and ask those Westwegians amongst us, Is it still illegal to "carry" an exposed bottle while walking on the street?
When we were over in WA a couple of years ago, we went to a BYO resturant with some friends we hadn't seen for many years. My mate and I strolled over to the Liquor store and bought a bottle of wine each and on the way back, passing a rubbish bin, I removed the brown paper bag and put it in the bin.
WELL, do you think I got TOLD by my mate. It seems as though it is illegal to remove the "wrapping" from your purchase, until you have removed yourself from the sidewalk.
Nice place WA, but a little "backwards" methinks.
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Reply By: Mike Harding - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 19:23
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 19:23
Given that we have legislation providing positive advantages to persons who can prove they are of Aboriginal descent why are these possession laws not also targeted purely at persons of Aboriginal descent, after all, it is the alcohol issue in Aboriginal communities these laws are intended to address? Separate laws could be in place for persons of any descent who supply or consume alcohol in these dry areas? Or would that be Politically Incorrect?
Mike Harding
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Follow Up By: Flash - Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 22:19
Wednesday, Sep 13, 2006 at 22:19
The whole thing is a bloody disgrace.
If I'm selling grog to the aboriginals- sure throw the book at me. I have no argument with that.
But to tell me I can't have grog for my own consumption- I'd love someone to challenge that in the high court.
What a disgrace.
And then to think people can end up with a criminal record record, for having a slab or some bottles of wine for their own relaxation and enjoyment........
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