Water Wastage

Submitted: Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 02:26
ThreadID: 39428 Views:2862 Replies:8 FollowUps:8
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Just got back from a great 7 days around Jamieson area, only problem with the place is its to close to Melbourne LOL.

On they way over all that were doing the trip were amazed at the waste of water in area's such as Swan Hill, Kerang, Echuca etc. I think I am right (correct me if I'm wrong) with these statements. In the Riverland area S.A. open channel watering (transfer) is banned (50% is lost to evaporation). All of the area's mentioned above had large amounts of open irrigation channels exposed to the sun.

I am sure most Riverland Fruit Growers who have had their water allocations cut to about 60% and with threats of cuts to 50% this year would be stunned to see whats happening upstream, to add insult we learned whilst over in the Swan Hill area that locals had also had their allocations cut (I believe the figure is a LOW 92%) what a joke.

How can 3 states that share the same water course have such different ideas into preservation. As a Crow Eater I can except all the jokes regarding us being slower etc, but find it a bit to big a pill to swallow when I see growers in this area going to wall, with Suicides expected to increase. I hope authorities can level up the water usage and management before its to late and we don't have a River Murray anymore.

I wont even bother mentioning the Rice and cotton that has been grown on and above the Darling, thats just to laughable.

Des Lexic is heading up that way the weekend, hope he can also have a look and see if I misread the situation.
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Reply By: pt_nomad - Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 06:08

Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 06:08
Blaze,
We were though the area a few weeks ago on a journey down to the murray mouth. On the face of it, I'd have to agree with you. I also noticed a fair amount of spray irrigation as well.
One thing that really stood out to me was the large number of the domestic gardens in these river towns have lovely green lawns. The sort of lawns that we used to have here in Canberra, back when it used to rain. I'm not sure what the rules are but it does not look like there is to much in the way of water restriction along the river.
Heard an interesting story from a fellow at CSIRO the other day with respect to water allocations. A person / property owns an allocation for volume X. In the days of very wide spread flood irrigation, a fair portion of Volume X made it back to the river via run off and under ground flow. In these days of increase irrigation efficiency, the full (available) allocation of volume X is still used. Due to the increase efficiency of irrigation methods, the returns to the river are minimal.
I'm not one for cocky bashing, I think primary industry is a crucial part of the Australian fabric. The problem of over resource allocation is a government (mainly states) created problem.
Don't rekon little Johnny's recent attempts at a quick file will lead to much more than a political fix in the short term.
I am starting to think that water should be managed nationally.
As far as water wastage goes, the SA water storage of Lake Victoria, in NSW, is one big evaporation basin, located in a almost desert like region. As you point out with the open channels, better could be done. Similarly to open channel transfers, an engineering solution to the SA water storage waste of water through evaporation is required. That would take significant amounts of cash - so probably wont happen.

Paul.
Still a great river tho.
Good chance I'll find my way over to SA next year for holidays again - 3rd year in a row. this time probably to rent a boat from customs house :)
Love the state - those 'holiday' camping NP access passes are fantastic.
AnswerID: 204805

Reply By: Kev M (NSW) - Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 06:45

Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 06:45
Why cant Little Johnny and is idiot friends build a pipeline from the top end to some of the major tributaries of these rivers. A controlled flow from this pipeline would allow the river to at least have some sort of flow in it to prevent long term damage. From what I've heard the Ord river releases about 5 times the quanitity of Sydney harbour a day into the Indian ocean. Why not use some of that.
It's just an idea although expensive.

Cheers Kev
Russell Coight:
He was presented with a difficult decision: push on into the stretching deserts, or return home to his wife.

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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew (QLD) - Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 08:24

Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 08:24
Finincially and physically difficult, if not impossible to achieve. From a previous posting on this subject:

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Next to impossible to achieve. As a rule of thumb, 1m diametre pipe for this purpose costs $1000/m ......best case scenario, 2750km, dead straight. So there goes 2.7 Billion dollars. That is without taking in account pump stations ($2m+ per pump station per 100km, best case), balance tanks, surge protection for water hammer, telemetry, huge valves, redundancy protection, electricity supply to each pump station, etc etc.

The other issue with these types of schemes is that in the process they go through numerous shire who would want to tap into the scheme. It ends up being a nightmare :-) Don't even think about the native title issues :-)

A 1m pipe, ignoring offtakes, would be able to supply 135 Ml per day, which is enough to supply a city the size of Townsville (150,000) let alone Brisbane's 2 million + !!!

The numbers we are talking about would put the Snowy Hydro to shame ;-)

=================================================

Rather than take water from another area, it would make more sense to take ownership of the problem and fix it at a local level. It annoys me when organisations/political parties etc bring up the idea of harvesting water from "up north" to supply the southerners with something they have misused over time. When the "northerners" ask for a couple of dollars to upgrade roads to basic levels, the old excuse of "the M1 upgrade is more important", or " the river tunnel (brisbane) is being considered" just doesn't cut it. It seems to me that the larger cities want the best of both worlds, water and world class roads, higher speed broadband, high speed mobile phone networks etc whereas they really should be looking at compromising on some things and decide what really is important. I realise that it is not that simple, however people need to appreciate what they have and manage what they need smarter.

Just my thoughts....

Andrew
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Follow Up By: cackles - Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 08:41

Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 08:41
I agree 100% Andrew, the highway north of Bowen is a a joke and yet Peter Beattie wants to take water from Burdekin Dam? What a joke.

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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew (QLD) - Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 08:51

Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 08:51
There's a highway?

I thought that it was another track to allow us to engage 4wd ;-)

Just look at the Bruce Highway just north of ingham, absolutely cr@p, low-lying, no road shoulder whatsoever, major dropoffs into floodwaters when wet......absolutely scarey when driving through at night, pooring rain, low visibility!

Andrew
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Follow Up By: Member - JohnR (Vic)&Moses - Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 09:28

Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 09:28
Spot on Andrew. Idiotic to suggest it actually. It is only just becoming feasible to pipe some of the water in Victoria with the cost of lighterand lower cost piping and even then only to enclosed tanks. The birds, fish, yabbies and lots of water creatures we have supported over the years will die off unless farmers can put in watering points to them. One farmer I was talking to was going to spend $250k to pipe water round his farm and that was two or so years ago. That is just another house in cost eh?
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Reply By: Member - Jack - Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 08:24

Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 08:24
Spot on Blaze. Water should be a national responsibility, as local and State Governments do not have the brains to deal with it.

Little Johnny has appointed Malcom Turnbull to oversee issues related to water at a Federal level. Not sure what that will do.

On our recent trip around Oz, we were stunned to see the amount of available water, particularly in the north of the country.

As pointed out in the previous post, the Ord River is massive, and a pipeline from there would be a huge boost. When I Darwin, my mate there told us that during the wet they can get up to 6" of rain in a single afternoon. I naively asked where that flowed to (expecting to be told some dam or other) and he told me .. "straight out to sea". They lose more than they use. And in Darwin and surrounding areas there was no shortage of domestic sprinklers keeping things nice and green.

In NSW the local pollies are all about desalination ... we have a number of small plants operating up here on the NSW Central Coast. Either that or digging up water underneath dams. Duh !!!! In Toowoomba, a referendum to recycle waste water was defeated (another politically manipulated decision???), and there is talk that in WA they are planning (or investigating??) charging domestic residents for their use of bore water. Peter Beattie grandly announced a "summit" of local council officials to solve the water problems of Queensland when we passed through there. My guess (as we saw nothing in the form of outcomes published in the papers when we were up there) was he told them to use less water - no concrete plans apart from his earlier announcement to flood the Mary Valley. Nice one!!!

Here in NSW, the Premier has just announced the building of a dam in the Newcastle area, which we suspect is a political smoke screen to deaden the current scandal surrounding a local State Minister and his alleged dealings with children. They don't want to lose too many votes up this way. Not sure how he will go when the Greens kick up a stink.

Yes - water is too big for State Authorities to deal with. I think planning a trip to the loo is beyond most of them.

One hopes when there is a referendum on the republic again, there will also be one that can eradicate this expensive, wasteful and completly unnecessary arm of politics - State Government.

Unfortunately, with the current spate of brain dead, survivalist politicians across Australia you would never get another Snowy Mountains Scheme, or any other grand piece of infrastructure.. Today's politicians have less foresight than Stevie Wonder !!!!!

Whew!!! I feel better now !!!!! Rant ends here ----------------------------------- >

Jack

The hurrieder I go, the behinder I get. (Lewis Carroll-Alice In Wonderland)

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AnswerID: 204819

Reply By: Member - Phil G (SA) - Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 09:09

Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 09:09
Two weeks ago, we travelled the Sturt Highway, and like you I was surprised to see so many flooded rice fields on the Hay road. Never noticed them before.

I reckon they could build a short pipeline that bypasses the cotton farms in Qld :-)))
AnswerID: 204829

Follow Up By: Mike Harding - Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 09:17

Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 09:17
I'm no expert in this area so could someone please explain to me why it's even _permitted_ to grow crops such as rice and cotton in one of the driest continents on earth? Especially as Australian rice appears to sell at about the same price as Thai rice – which is a better product anyway imo.

Perhaps I'm too cynical (nah!) but I wonder if big business and profits doesn't override the concern regarding water purported by our glorious leaders - big business, all too often, seems to be able to rape natural resources with impunity.

Mike Harding
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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew (QLD) - Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 09:27

Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 09:27
What else would you do with some of that land now Mike ;-) Most of it is devoid of even so much as a speed-bump, let alone a tree.....

Phil, NSW produces 2/3rds of Australia Cotton, therefore to say that we should divert water around Qld cotton farms eg cubbie is just ignoring the overall problem of water use with cotton and similar crops. Interestingly, the Cotton Industry states that only 84% of cotton is grown under irrigation......looks like it might be possible to use less water and still have a viable crop.

Andrew
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Follow Up By: Muzzgit [WA] - Wednesday, Nov 15, 2006 at 00:11

Wednesday, Nov 15, 2006 at 00:11
Lets not forget how much clothing and textiles go up in price when there is a percieved shortage in cotton, as happenned about 14 years ago.

Every thing from basic denim jeans and bed sheets to insulation goes nuts when there aint enough cotton around.
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Reply By: Sand Man (SA) - Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 11:56

Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 11:56
From my understanding, it goes a little further than "simple" irrigation.
South Australiian Growers in the Riverland lead by example on what can be achieved by "smarter" irrigation. The methods employed, reduce the amount of evaporation and other causes of wasted water, whilst giving the crops sufficient water to grow.

I think the whole solution was worked out by the growers, State Government and CSIRO, etc.

I would have to totally agree with elimination of some crops that are proven to be water hungry though. Australia just cannot afford to support inefficient primary industries such as rice and cotton.

Bill


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AnswerID: 204866

Reply By: Scoof - Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 16:05

Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 16:05
Open irrigation channels waste that much water,the Loxton scheme in the Riverland saved over 4800 megalitres in one year just by getting rid of all the open irrigation channels and installing pipes. Just one scheme in one town.
Cheers: Scoof.
AnswerID: 204909

Follow Up By: Member - Andrew (QLD) - Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 16:59

Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 16:59
Actual water savings is due to the Loxton Scheme being an on-demand pressurised pipe system, with the cost of water being much higher than previously available with a channel system. Irrigators tend to look at costs of water closely and are generally influenced by costs rather than losses (as the losses are mainly in the unmetered main channels). Real-world savings are calculated to take in account re-education of farming practices within the scheme.....the 4.8GL quoted was only an estimate, and as such will only be achieved if better irrigation practices are adopted at the same time. If i recall correctly, there was something like 56% of irrigators in this scheme that were using inefficient watering practices, mainly due to demand issues, and this the quoted savings would be taking new practices into account. Obviously some of this savings would be due to reduced evaporation, leakage, and even possibly reduced flowrates at peak times.

Award winning concept, which should have significant water savings no doubt.

Andrew

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Reply By: LastAussieWorker - Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 17:07

Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 17:07
if it was only 50% evaporation it would not be to bad. In some cases it is 82% evaporation and seepage. Vic and NSW have totally different water systems. Vic system comes from Victorian storage and NSW comes from NSW storage. NSW does not have storage capacity like Vic does. Vic got their water act together years ago and NSW did nothing. While the water may all come out the same river down stream, that is not the case upstream. Consider the Murray River a big shared pipe and each puts in and takes out along the way. All screamed when Vic put in their water system and it has proven the answer. Farmers know prior to the season starting how much water they will have, unlike NSW.
Murray Darling Basin Commission works firmly on the principle if they never ever do anything other than do consultants reports they can never be accused of failing. Heaps could be done on the ground that is simple functional and would achieve results, but they as in the Murray Darling Basin Commission chooses to do nothing as it is simpler. Tea parties dinners and trips away are the speciality of the Murray Darling Basin Commission and that is the limit of their ability to organise anything.
AnswerID: 204920

Reply By: Crackles - Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 21:23

Tuesday, Nov 14, 2006 at 21:23
Farmers should be given 20 years to change from inefficient systems like flood irrigation & either pipe or line all open channels. Governments would need to subsidise the project in some way but anyone not conforming should have their water allocation halved. A farmer near Lake William Hovell told me for every 100 litres of water that leaves the dam only 10 litres makes it to the farms at Mildura.......all lost in seepage & evaporation. We have plenty of water just we don't make the best use of it.
Cheers Craig...........
AnswerID: 204984

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