GME Fau Pa!! help needed tech issue

Submitted: Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 13:45
ThreadID: 44705 Views:7335 Replies:4 FollowUps:9
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G'Day all,

Well i seem to be suffering from a severe case of 'passion fingers' at the moment....

long story short I have stuffed my UHF in my boat, I had a flat battery and on replacing somehow had a seniors moment and managed to reverse polarity my radio!!

What a total Richard Cranium!!!

Its a GME TX4600, now checking the spec it has got reverse polarity protection in the form of a shunt diode.
I'm assuming this diode is sacrificial, and goes open circuit to protect the radio.

My Question.... has anyone been down this road?

I'm a techy myself but inside this is all surface mount components, and I'm not kitted up to work on the small stuff, if it wasnt surface mount it'd be a quick trip to tricky Dicks and replace it and solder it in again......... however its not.

Wondering how I go about getting it replaced, will it need to go to GME, or anyone had a repair like this done?

As usual any info appreciated,

In the meantime I'm just not touching anything else at the moment till my curse passes!!!!

Rgds

Ron
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Reply By: Shaker - Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 14:36

Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 14:36
Where are you located?
AnswerID: 235740

Follow Up By: Ron173 - Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 18:48

Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 18:48
I'm in Northern NSW 2340 near Tamworth

thanks
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FollowupID: 496947

Follow Up By: Shaker - Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 22:51

Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 22:51
Thats no good, because the tech at the marina that I work at was with GME for many years, but that's in Victoria!
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FollowupID: 497006

Reply By: Mike Harding - Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 14:59

Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 14:59
I'm not a big fan of doing reverse polarity protection that way - it doesn't guarantee other PN junctions in the circuit will not conduct... anyway... the diode will probably be located very close to where the 12V enters the PCB. It'll probably be a 5 or 10A diode so should be pretty chunky even in surface mount form.

If the only consequence of the reverse polarity was to open circuit the diode and blow the fuse then once the fuse has been replaced the radio should work as the diode is, essentially, not there any more - just DON'T reverse it again until you replace the diode and ensure you use an identical once to the GME part - hopefully, but I'm not holding my breath, they will have chosen one with a low forward voltage.

Mike Harding
AnswerID: 235745

Follow Up By: Ron173 - Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 18:55

Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 18:55
Mike,

prob is, radio has a connecter at rear, and I'm getting 12v there, so fuse cant be gone, thats why I'm assuming diode gone.

Unless somehow I'm picking up a false voltage thru capacitance or something??

Will dig thru to fuse n check, just its not an easy access one, bad fit I know, one of these always meant to change it jobs, but as I'm getting voltage at end of line directly where radio connects, I cant see how the fuse could possibly be gone.

I had a look inside, nothing visible on 12v inlet that looks remotely replaceable or blown.

Reckon its a put it in somewhere job, just trying to suss out best option of where to go.

Local shop say $44 to look at, plus repair cost, but trying to spin me that there could be more damage.. I'm thinking that the diode should be it, and I'm being passed the vaseline jar....?

Ron
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FollowupID: 496950

Follow Up By: Mike Harding - Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 20:54

Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 20:54
If you have 12V at the radio terminals but it isn't working then it's probably stuffed.
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FollowupID: 496982

Reply By: brett - Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 17:53

Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 17:53
Did you have a suitably rated fuse in line? as generally the fuse blows before the diode, When you connect it up the wrong way current flows through the diode and blows the fuse. And when the diode blows it usually goes short circuit, if it's gone open circuit then the radio will still work it just means you have no reverse polarity protection anymore. The diode is only used for reverse polarity in normal operation it is reverse biased and no current flows.So if your radio is not working and it's not blowing a fuse every time you connect it up then the diode is not your problem. In 25 years of CB's I've destroyed numerous protection diodes and they all went short circuit and all went this way because there was no fuse in line or the fuse was a bolt.If the diode did go open circuit or it was just removed to get the CB going, had to get back to the YL's ASAP, the next time it was connected the wrong way there were a few bit's that got fried, in the old AM/SSB rigs it was the audio IC.
So if your radio is not blowing the fuse and it still won't power up there are more bits fired than the protection diode.
AnswerID: 235772

Follow Up By: Ron173 - Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 18:56

Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 18:56
yep had the standard 3a fuse in there but its not blown??
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FollowupID: 496951

Follow Up By: Grungle - Thursday, Apr 26, 2007 at 16:01

Thursday, Apr 26, 2007 at 16:01
Unfortunately fuses do not protect against reverse polarity or over voltage.

Regards
David
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FollowupID: 497108

Reply By: Michael Carey - Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 18:55

Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 18:55
I've not had the pleasure of working on a TX4600 yet. But generally, GME does a good job with reverse/over voltage protection.
Usually a 16V zener diode is placed across the incoming supply, hopefully you had a properly rated fuse between the radio and the battery. This zener diode will blow the fuse on application of reverse polarity or over voltage (>16V).
50% of the time, application of reverse polarity blows the fuse and nothing else happens, a replacement fuse get the radio up and going again. The other 50% of the time, the zener diode goes short circuit and replacement fuses continue to blow.
If you have a multimeter, check for a short circuit between the red and black wires on your radio. If there is a short circuit, then you had best get it to someone that can replace the zener diode and check the rest of the radio.
If there is no short circuit and you are game, install a new fuse and hook it up (the right way around) and see what happens.
The GME TX3200/3400 series radios also had a small internal fuse (a circuit board track) that would blow if the user continued to fit bigger and bigger fuses until the zener diode cracked open and no longer provided protection. The TX4600 might have a similar internal fuse as well.
Surface mount components aren't really meant for people to work on them, I hate having to do the mod on the TX32/3400 radios for the new UHF output power module, the replacement resistors are the size of a couple of grains of sand!
AnswerID: 235777

Follow Up By: Ron173 - Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 19:51

Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 19:51
Thanks Michael,

Hmmm funny one, I keep two sheathed hypodermics, purposefully for sticking in connectors to read voltages etc., and on placing them inside the rear of the radio connector, and subsequently attaching my meter leads, I am NOT getting a short circuit?

Would this indicate the radio is ok??

I'm tempted to rig up a power supply to the radio and see how it goes with a direct supply rigged, correctly this time of course!!

If this works ok, I assume your saying I should get the diode replaced as it will only work once and I had my once?

Then again, would I be so stupid twice??? no answers please.... oh go on then.... I desreve it!

Rgds

Ron
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FollowupID: 496967

Follow Up By: Michael Carey - Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 20:09

Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 20:09
It's quite possible that no damage has been done to the radio. if the fuse blew before the zener diode stressed out enough to go short circuit, then the radio will be fine. If you don't have access to someone with more tech knowledge, hook the radio up with a smaller fuse than normal for a test. Something like a 0.5 amp fuse will allow you power up the radio (don't transmit), if the fuse blows straight away with a bright flash, then the radio will require further attention. If the radio powers up OK, then you are probably right to put the right fuse back in and try out the radio.
If you aren't measuring a short circuit but the radio refuses to power up, then it's probably due for a trip to someone with more technical knowledge on the TX4600, possibly to check for an internal fuse.
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FollowupID: 496972

Follow Up By: Russ n Sue - Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 23:12

Wednesday, Apr 25, 2007 at 23:12
It reminds me of my early days in communications and two-way radios...we had an instructor whose favourite saying was "tune for maximum smoke Gentlemen". And a lot of the time we did....tehe.

Cheers,

Russ.
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FollowupID: 497011

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