Are mods really necessary?

Submitted: Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 22:11
ThreadID: 48896 Views:4844 Replies:21 FollowUps:44
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All this talk of modifications really puzzles me. Why do you do it? The aim of most seems to be to improve performance. For the last 10 years I have run stock standard Prados. I get good fuel economy. They will easily pass a road train by accelerating quickly to about 140kph. Their top speed is somewhere around 170kph (same for petrol and diesel but diesel takes a bit longer to get there) - only did it a couple of times in the territory but they all do it. Coupled with that they have never failed to start and run properly. Why would I modify it?
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Reply By: Matt(WA) - Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 22:19

Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 22:19
What type of mods are you talking about there andy? Engine? Body? Interior? I have changed my car to suit myself and fiancee. Engine mods that I have done are minimal but you try towing a van with a NA 1hz. Not much fun. So I am making my car fit for purpose, as I didnt have the coin to go out and buy a brand new one. So I found the newest fourby I could afford, with the least amount of kays and am now making it suit me. So for me modifications were needed.
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Reply By: stefan P (Penrith NSW) - Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 22:19

Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 22:19
congrats for your choice, but life would be quite boring if we all drove stock white toyotas.

Cheers Stefan
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Follow Up By: Member - Stephen M (NSW) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 17:42

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 17:42
Geez Stefan, Im glad Ive got some silver on the bottom of mine and now some OME and A/T's !! only kidding !! everyone to there own and yes life would be very boring if we were all the same and had the same things. Speak to you later Regards Steve M
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Follow Up By: Kev M (QLD Bound) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 17:46

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 17:46
Steve,

Looks good with the new OME's on, What's next??

Kev
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Follow Up By: Member - Stephen M (NSW) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 20:27

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 20:27
Hi Kev, yes has made a huge difference to drive around town a fair bit firmer which is good has got rid of the sloppy rolling feeling it had. Haven't taken it scrub yet to see how wheel travel goes and compare to the old lux.Got just over 50 mill on the rear and just under on the front, but the rear had sagged and I think being a grande they were softer then other models to give a more plush ride but it would bottom out on the diff stops over the slightest speed hump but not now, have had two people in the back and virtually doesn't drop might be different when loaded up and both tanks chock o block. Next !!! Well I have to start again with the cunning kit to save for rear diff lock. Dual batts getting done in a few weeks (ARB). Trying to score a bull bar from ebay instead of buying a new one, has been a few but in other states and would cost me couple of hundred $$ just to get sent down and spending that amount I would like to see it prior to buying. There was one on there the other week but he didn't know whether air bag compatible or not. Some people have no idea what there selling pain in the ar@e.So your leaving/left us and changing states eh ?? Good luck to you,I would do the same if my wife's family wasn't still living here, hanging to get out of Sydney, as soon as they move were gone she has agreed to that. Hope all is. Take Care Regards Steve M
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Follow Up By: Kev M (QLD Bound) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 20:34

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 20:34
Steve,

Should join us for the trip south in November, hopefully I'll have the new rig by then
and yes Aandy it will be modified from a Wagon to a dual cab cause I can ha ha ha.

At this stage we may be loitering in cockroach land for a little at the outlaws place (Woolgoolga) until we can find somewhere to settle down at (a job would be good as well LOL) in Queensland.

Cheers Kev
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Follow Up By: Member - Stephen M (NSW) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 21:30

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 21:30
Would love to but already going away that month, dam !!!Definately another time thou if the offer still stands later on. Regards steve M
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Reply By: Brew34.5(SA) - Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 22:22

Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 22:22
Not sure if you are fishing mate??? Anyway obviously your needs are what you have. And someone else who tows a heavy load may need h/d suspension. Someone else who does lots of rock hoping needs a big lift. We all modify to our needs. I guarantee your stock Prado would struggle to get places a heavily modified Prado would take you.
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Reply By: Andrew(WA) - Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 22:23

Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 22:23
Good point Andy

All I did to My Poootrol was add decent shockies and Poly air bags for the load weight. Chucked in a dual battery to run the fridge but I wouldn't really call those things 'mods' as such.

Took me all over Australia without a drama. Even places I was scared to tread...no worries.

All depends on the pocket I guess.
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Reply By: Member - shane (SA) - Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 22:39

Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 22:39
where do you start, for an every day black top and light 4x4 work you are 100% right, but for me i travel interstate alot. mostly at night with about 2 tonne on trailer and about 500kg in the wagon. so firstly i fill the need for a steel bull bar. ( had ali one and folded up the first roo i hit). i like fishing also, so a winch is good for the beach, {just in case), so with those to items i need heavier front springs for safety. this brings front up to standard height. i have spotlight on the front for when im driving from state to state. then because i go on sand i need a compressor for tyres. need heavy springs on back for the extra weight as standard sag to much. have turbo timer so i dont sit in wagon waiting for turbo to cool down. have uhf radio for where my phone does not work.
my point is, most mods are necessary for life style or work.
this is my excuse and im sticking to it.
AnswerID: 258199

Follow Up By: Gerhardp1 - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 10:49

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 10:49
You evil modifier, you.....

I haven't modified the Jack either, just added a snorkel, stronger torsion bars, higher springs in the rear, polyairs, towbar, better light globes, drilled and slotted discs for better stopping.


Damn, I didn't know a white Prado wouldn't need any of this.....
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Reply By: Motherhen - Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 22:57

Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 22:57
Ah but you read the 4WD mags and get tempted!

Really, it is like a house - we all have a kitchen, living room, bedroom etc, but we decorate it and put furniture in to suit out tastes and our needs.
Motherhen

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Follow Up By: Member - JohnR (Vic)&Moses - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 15:14

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 15:14
Hiya Mutha, I guess then when you modify the BT more to be like home Jim will need a bigger V8 to pull it ;-))))
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Reply By: Oldsquizzy (Kununurra) - Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 23:41

Monday, Aug 20, 2007 at 23:41
Tis a choice thing. You choose not to, others choose to. Tis the beauty of having the ability to choose
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Reply By: Member - Jeff H (QLD) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 00:43

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 00:43
Exactly.
When/If the need arises, you'll know.
Jeff H.
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Follow Up By: Member - Jeff H (QLD) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 00:50

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 00:50
ps.
perhaps.
Don't be afraid to look.
JH.
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Reply By: Richard Kovac - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 00:55

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 00:55
no
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Follow Up By: Redback - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 10:04

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 10:04
yes
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 10:43

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 10:43
maybe
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Follow Up By: Kev M (QLD Bound) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 11:05

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 11:05
Possibly
Russell Coight:
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Follow Up By: Redback - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 11:14

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 11:14
Yet!!
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Follow Up By: Pajman Pete (SA) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 17:08

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 17:08
Sometimes
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Follow Up By: Max - Sydney - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 18:41

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 18:41
Are you sure?
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Follow Up By: BennyGU - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 19:27

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 19:27
Could be
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Follow Up By: BennyGU - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 19:27

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 19:27
Could be
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Follow Up By: Willem - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 21:07

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 21:07
Hmmmmmm.......................
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Follow Up By: Muzzgit [WA] - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 23:09

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 23:09
I'm not tellin'

.
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Friday, Aug 24, 2007 at 07:29

Friday, Aug 24, 2007 at 07:29
But?!
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Reply By: Member - Doug T (Qld) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 08:26

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 08:26
Aandy
I guess if you only run around on the sealed roads at 140kph then yeh maybe Mods are not your scene, maybe you should own a Tarago or a Kia people mover ,It depends on what you use it for, Can you imagine what would happen to the driver of a Rally car and the car if that car were standard,not to mention the 4x4 enthusiast who does Rock crawling and or competes his everyday 4x4 in events at sport meetings, As for me the mod that I did to mine was in the suspension area for all road and desert use, it changed the handling and safety of my 4x4 so much you would have to experience before and after yourself to appreciate the benefit, makes me wonder why OME is not used as standard fitting from the factory in the first place
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Follow Up By: Member - Doug T (Qld) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 08:31

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 08:31
Oh whan an Intelligent answer from above, about as much as one could expect
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Follow Up By: Member - Jeff H (QLD) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 11:33

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 11:33
You're a naughty boy Dusty, but "Yes", "Maybe" and "Possibly" were pretty well spot on.

Jess.
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Reply By: Wizard1 - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 10:43

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 10:43
You coild leave your vehicle stock but then again you limit what you can do.

We bought a stock new Prado 95 series TD several years ago, essentially to do some off road work and as a tow vehicle for our caravan.

Everything was good in the early days.

Front protection bar.

The UHF CB, pretty handy when on the road especially in WA.

Needed more storage space and didn't want to carry a back full of plastic boxes, swags and snot, so I built some draws and a roof rack went on for those weeks away in remote WA.

Then we got tired of not being able to power our Waeco when stopped, as well as the starting battery trying to power the as an issue so the dual battery system went in.

Then I moved to the NT, Umm water crossings and the improved air intake won't hurt, so on goes the snorkel.

Wanted more power, etc when towing, so in goes the Dtronic. Very handy when you need to pass road trains at 120 pkh with a boat attached.

Found the standard Tojo rear suspension was going south, so new springs and a set of Polyairs.

Fit an Anderson plug off the second battery for improved 12V power to the van.

Tojo shocks give up, set of TJM go in.

Mandrel exhaust for even more towing power and torque.

As you see there is always a reason. The vehicle becomes more capable and a better touring truck. I suppose we could have left it standard, but stuff still would have broken and needed changing.

I suppose doing a 170 KPH is the big test is it? I'ld prefer a vehicle setup for better touring and off road adventures thanks.

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Reply By: Robin Miller - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 11:23

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 11:23
Hi Andy

Prado's are simply a much less stable vehicle than many others.

I.E. They tip over easily. Most don't even look at these things when buying a car.

I would not have one, without modifications .

I'd much prefer to take my chances with an engine blow up
in a 3lt Patrol than a rollover on the highway.

Choice is with the purchaser.

Robin Miller






AnswerID: 258258

Follow Up By: TerraFirma - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 13:29

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 13:29
Prados tip over easily...??? Wow Robin that is a big statement coming from you..! Please...
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Follow Up By: Member - bushfix - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 14:24

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 14:24
what a crock!

probably less of them sold (as lots of Prados don't leave the tar) but troopy centre of gravity may be even higher but how many reports have we of troopies rolling?

please elaborate

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Follow Up By: TerraFirma - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 14:38

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 14:38
I love it Robin, Prados tip over easily', he he..! Then you justify your purchase by taking a chance with a vehicle that blows up..! Please... Someone.. Give me a rig that doesn't tip over and blow up..! LOL

A Toyota Landcruiser perhaps..? Or do they discintegrate on the 1st bump..??


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Follow Up By: Robin Miller - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 14:54

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 14:54
Hi Guys

Its one of those specifications that has gone of the boil these days. In America the situation got so bad that some vehicles have had to be recalled or modified. One famous case was mini buses and loading them high and behind the rear axles.
The legal document of this was on the web and made fascinating reading.

This situation is common to many 4wds and can make them unstable under braking or turning sharply.

In many owner manuals there were warnings about this.

Road tests of vehicles used to do tests on a tilt table and many cars figures can be seen in earlier magazines such as RACV etc.

Its actually hard to get figures but I was involved with a test of the first prados series (90) at Anglesea.
Its a tall car on a narrow wheelbase and I felt unsafe.
The later series was improved a bit.
I do not have the results of tilt table test for it to hand but I believe it was around 42-43 degrees.

Against this the landcruiser 100 series brochure claimed 45 degrees which is better , however the Nissan GU series wins hands down at a published 48 degrees.
As well the GU has a longer wheelbase and these factors make it inherently less likely to roll and the best choice for those not so flat tracks.

Robin Miller













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Follow Up By: Member - bushfix - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 14:59

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 14:59
"They tip over easily"


I'd much prefer to take my chances with an engine blow up
in a 3lt Patrol than a rollover on the highway.


those were the comments you made, bit different to pushing a tip over angle off road.

like troopies, the narrow wheel base is taken into account when off road, though I don't hear of many Fritzes rolling their Britzes. Specs are one thing, reported events are another.

cheers Robin.
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Follow Up By: TerraFirma - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 15:10

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 15:10
Robin, I would rather not accept a vehicle that easily rolls over nor has it's engine blow up thankyou, and fortunately I own neither of these vehicles.! My Landcruiser has served me well, has proved incredibly reliable, has never rolled nor exploded it's engine and for that I now feel incredibly grateful..! LOL

P.S. I have been involved in the testing of my Landcruiser privately for many years and can report back now:
"King Of the Road"

LOL ....
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Follow Up By: Member - JohnR (Vic)&Moses - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 15:19

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 15:19
Robin, last year there was a count on the Playdohs burning too in the outback from spinifex resin underneath on the exhaust. Pays to clean underneath often.
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Follow Up By: TerraFirma - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 16:07

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 16:07
LOL..! Very funny..
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Follow Up By: Markymark - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 21:30

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 21:30
Well it's been a while since I've driven a standard Prado but mine has an OME medium rating 2inch lift and while I do sit up high, it handles very well around fast corners MUCH better than my old Rangie that would rock & roll something shocking. But even that didn't roll over, even though it felt like it would.

In saying they tip over you really need evidence to back it up, not simply say one made you feel unsafe.

Mark.
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Follow Up By: Robin Miller - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 21:46

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 21:46
Hi Mark

Tilt table tests are standard industry practise and part of qualifying a vehicle for stability , in Victoria many are carried out at Seymour army base, what else do you wish ?

Robin Miller
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Follow Up By: Markymark - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 22:03

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 22:03
I wish for lots of things Robin but I don't always get them!

I see where your coming from with the tilt table and I don't argue that 90 series Prado's are skinny & tall and GU Patrols and wide and long, a good combo for no doubt. It's also one of the reasons I was put off getting a Troopy.

However, there are lots of other factors to consider such as suspension mods and quality of rubber, the driver behind the wheel etc. I don't recall seeing figures from road crashes alarming us to Prado's rolling over in crashes more than other 4wd's. I have heard of 4wd's in general but nothing on a specific model. There's something I wish for!

Thanks for the good discussion,

Mark.
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Reply By: Axel [ the real one ] - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 14:45

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 14:45
Modification necessary ?? bet that even though you claim to have run stock standard playdoes for the last 10 years , that they have NOT been bog stock standard , what about your replacement tires ,the floor mats , the seat covers , that extra little convex mirror stuck on so you could see behind , or that time you used a different brand of oil , each and every one a modification.
AnswerID: 258289

Reply By: Truckster (Vic) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 16:43

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 16:43
Love to see a std playdo go to some places we wheel.. :)
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Follow Up By: lc_120man - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 21:15

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 21:15
So where are we going? ;)
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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 22:36

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 22:36
yours aint stock :P
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Reply By: Brew34.5(SA) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 17:31

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 17:31
Enough fish yet?????
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Follow Up By: Member - Stephen F (VIC) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 17:55

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 17:55
I would say he's reached his bag limit. :)
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Reply By: blue one - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 19:27

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 19:27
Fishing
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Reply By: _gmd_pps - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 19:33

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 19:33
haha ... it's a bit like using a 6MP point & shoot camera
and then using a real one ... or using an Intel P4 and then
twin duocore Opterons for image editing ...

there is no car/truck on the market which would fit my need without modification ... as there is no branded computer which would fit my needs ... so I put them together myself ...

load 2.4T on a truck with a 28' boat and make it go from 0 to 100 in 12 seconds or so :)) ...

Have fun with your Prado
gmd
AnswerID: 258336

Reply By: Cram - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 19:47

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 19:47
18mnths ago camping, fourwheel driving etc did not interest me in the slightest and I always wondered why people had to do this and that and have this and that.

Well now I have an off road camping trailer and a TD5 Disco and I love them both.

I now find myself trawling this forum, listening, reading and learning about things and doing mods and adding this and that to my rig and trailer.

And I love it.....

AnswerID: 258348

Reply By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 20:16

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 20:16
I agree ,
Mine is absolutely stock standard .
Willie .
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Follow Up By: Member - Stephen M (NSW) - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 21:25

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 21:25
LOL Willie, Just read your list out to my wife, she just looked at me and said NO. Regards Steve M
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Follow Up By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 22:26

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 22:26
OOPS !
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Follow Up By: Kev M (QLD Bound) - Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 at 06:14

Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 at 06:14
Does a new Gold Detector class a vehicle as modified?? :))

Kev
Russell Coight:
He was presented with a difficult decision: push on into the stretching deserts, or return home to his wife.

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Follow Up By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 at 09:20

Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 at 09:20
Hi Kev ,
No , because , so far it's unused . I cannot find anyone to go out and use it with . I need company .
Willie .
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Follow Up By: Kev M (QLD Bound) - Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 at 09:41

Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 at 09:41
Company or to act as a security guard to keep your haul safe

Kev
Russell Coight:
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Follow Up By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 at 10:31

Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 at 10:31
Kev ,
Just company and maybe a few tips on what to do and where to go .
My big trouble is that I retired at 54 , and all my mates are still working . I have no one to play with in the sand pit .
Willie .
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Follow Up By: Kev M (QLD Bound) - Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 at 19:46

Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 at 19:46
My 3 year old daughter has offered her services, she has a Tonka dump truck, front end loader and a backhoe, does she qualify LOL

Kev
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Reply By: murray murray - Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 21:44

Tuesday, Aug 21, 2007 at 21:44
Aandy, in 2005 we did central Australia and were concerned that our standard Jackaroo wouldn't cope. We met lots of people with rigs with all the mods and then met a Victorian vintage car club who did the same trip. Their youngest car was still pre 1920 and not a 2x4 amongst them, all single wheel drive. I told them they have made a mockery of the entire 4x4 industry and should be ashamed of themselves. When they bogged one of the cars, a Renault I think, they all gathered around, picked it up and lifted it out of the bog. Ya gotta laugh.
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Follow Up By: Brew34.5(SA) - Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 at 06:21

Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 at 06:21
Define Central Australia. Simpson???
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Follow Up By: murray murray - Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 at 18:45

Wednesday, Aug 22, 2007 at 18:45
No, not the Simpson. There are some places you need a proper 4B. We met people who had everything that open and shut who stayed on the main roads, although they're called tracks (eg Ooodnadatta) and here were several vintage cars doing the main tracks with not much more than the cars, spares and swags. I just found the contrast amusing.
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Reply By: Coops (Perth) - Thursday, Aug 23, 2007 at 11:18

Thursday, Aug 23, 2007 at 11:18
Because we can - life's all about choices my friend!!!

It would be pretty damned boring if we all did the same thing all the time
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