Value of buying an extended warranty - dubious

Submitted: Wednesday, Aug 29, 2007 at 23:19
ThreadID: 49141 Views:4108 Replies:20 FollowUps:12
This Thread has been Archived
Not Good Enough
I have a Nissan Patrol purchased new in 2003. It has been serviced by the dealer every 10,000 kms including all the larger services. The Standard warranty is for three years or 100,000kms whichever comes first.

Prior to the end of the normal warranty period I had three letters from my dealer offering an extended warranty for a cost of $1295. At this point I must say the dealer has done a very good job in handling the minor issues I have had with the vehicle. I accepted the offer and extended my warranty to finish in April 2009 or 150,000 kms which ever comes first.

Nissan Patrols have a reputation of a strong drive train - gear box, through front and rear differentials to the wheels but no longer for me.

While driving in a conservation park in South Australia I heard a noise like a stick dragging underneath. I looked for the stick and then finding nothing proceded. I next heard a noise slightly different and decided when back at the camp to not drive it further. On checking the magnetic plug found metal pieces on the magnet. The vehicle had travelled less than 100,000 kms and was four years and three months old.

We called Nissan Roadside assist and the vehicle collected after an abortive first attempt

Our vehicle was ultimately collected and taken to the nearest dealer in Port Augusta two days later.

It took Nissan two days to decide that they look into the differential. Eventually they did so and discovered that gears had stripped in several places, from the pinion gear that drives the crown wheel and the axles.

A part was on the water from Japan we were told after some days, then told the news, that Nissan said the vehicle was old and had travelled too far for the extended warranty to work for us and we would have to pay for the repairs.

We arrived home over two weeks later than intended and rather jaded at the further responses to a letter sent claiming further expenses that we also believe should be due to be covered.

The Extended warranty covered getting the vehicle from near Leigh Creek to Port Augusta only
Our additional expenses included
- getting ourselves to Port Augusta by friends
- getting our caravan to Port Augusta
- hire car or expenses any expenses there

The fact
- that a Nissan differential broke up is unusual as these are commonly used in competition vehicles.
- that Nissan have said to the dealer, that they were not going to assist as they did not consider there was a manufacturing fault
- in talking to Nissan Service department the assistant said that the vehicle is old and had travelled too far for it to be a manufacturing fault.
- in a letter to us, the Customer Relations Manager said "all the information to hand and has been subsequently declined, the circumstances surrounding your request being well outside our warranty guidelines for any assistance as no manufacturing fault has been found to be evident."
- we have not been reimbursed for any of our documented costs, despite being told that recovery of our caravan and ourselves should be covered.

If it wasn't a manufacturing fault, no one has quoted to me why it could have otherwise failed.

I believe Nissan are failing under my reading of the Extended Warranty Agreement when they spell out age and distance travelled as reasons why they will not honour their agreement and the above quote. They are certainly failing the spirit of the agreement.

What Nissan hadn't known was that we were looking to purchase another vehicle for our business based on our previous experience. Our dealer knew that we were interested as we had discussed that with the people there. Not now. Both the dealer who did the repair and our home dealer are puzzled at the response and denial - or so they said to me.

Obviously anyone purchasing an extended warranty from Nissan will have to evaluate even further what value such a warranty may entail.

The version here is slightly longer with only 3000 characters allowed there
Back Expand Un-Read 0 Moderator

Reply By: Member - John (Vic) - Wednesday, Aug 29, 2007 at 23:50

Wednesday, Aug 29, 2007 at 23:50
John I think I would be suing the ba$tards for both the repairs and damages in relation to their failure to honour the extended warranty.

Bet they settle!
VKS737 - Mobile 6352 (Selcall 6352)

Lifetime Member
My Profile  Send Message

AnswerID: 259496

Reply By: Olcoolone- Wednesday, Aug 29, 2007 at 23:58

Wednesday, Aug 29, 2007 at 23:58
Hello John, So they paid for the towing (wonder if the RAA contractor charged them for his trailer) but not the repairs.

How many K's has it done.

We have extendered warranties on some of out company vehicles and they are great.

If it is the K's, not out of date and hasn't been abused it should be covered......I would take it further because they are still selling you a product and that product has to be "fit for purpose".

Regards Richard
AnswerID: 259497

Follow Up By: Member - JohnR (Vic)&Moses - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 00:09

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 00:09
It didn't even clock up the 100,000 on the way home Richard. I gave it the birthday at 98k kms before we left for Warraweena.

That 'fit for purpose' clause is an interesting one. I guess it is out in the open now especially with the link above as they draw attention directly to the companies.
0
FollowupID: 520990

Follow Up By: Muddy doe (SA) - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 00:28

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 00:28
It is one thing saying a product has a 3 year warranty but it another to say that an item is "fit for purpose". There are legal definitions regarding fitness for purpose (depending what state jurisdiction you are in) but I have seen in court cases that a major consideration in assessing fitness for purpose of an item is the life expectancy of similar classes of items. Price paid can also be an issue.

If you buy a pair of shoes at a discount barn and they wear through or the stitching comes apart in a month then you accept this and go back and get another cheap pair. You probably got the expected life. If you go to a place like David Jones or Myer and pay $300 for a pair of shoes you would be miffed if you did not get quite a few years of wear from them.

I would generally think that a 4WD diff should be good for 8-10 years of normal service. Nissan is a reputable brand and charge a reasonable premium for their product. The manufacturer warrants it to be free of manufacturing defects for the first 3 years but the service life should be much longer. If you sued for damages then you may have a good chance of a win as that is a pretty early exit for that sort of item.

This is why many manufacturers often repair or replace items long after the warranty expires. This is often more about protecting the brand or trying to win repeat business (something that, as you point out Nissan Australia seems to be sadly lacking).

Aside from all that, they seem to have completely ignored the terms of the extended warranty agreement anyway! On face value it is still well within coverage. Something not right there!

So yes, raise a stink, explore your options. Don't just be fobbed off.

Cheers
Muddy
0
FollowupID: 520993

Follow Up By: Olcoolone- Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 13:24

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 13:24
The "Fit for purpose" was aimed at the extendered warranty as a product and not the part that broke.

Getting back to the shoe thing Muddy was speaking about, if you bought a pair of running shoes and after 10k of running the failed this could be said the product was not "fit for purpose"' if you bought a pair of high heel dress shoes and you went for a 10k run and they failed this would not be classed as "fit for purpose" as they wern't designed for running in.

If they sold you a warranty for your 4X4 and this warrant was aimed at a vehcle that never went of road, this is a "not fit for purpose" issue as they would know most 4X4's go off road.

If the part failed because it was used in an enviroment that it was not designed for, fair enough then no warranty claim.

If the part failed because it was used in an enviroment that it was designed for, then it should be a warranty claim.

Same as the extendered warranty if the warranty was sold to you with them knowing it was a 4X4 and it maybe used off road and you were within the conditions of the warranty, they should pay.

Here in S.A there was a big thing about mobile phones needing repairs and the phone makers refusing to repair because the phone had a scratch on it or it got moisture in it from sweet.

The makers lost because it was a matter of either the phone was not designed for the enviroment it was intended to be used in or it was.

The scratches and moister was part of the enviroment.




Regards Richard
0
FollowupID: 521042

Reply By: Blaze - Wednesday, Aug 29, 2007 at 23:59

Wednesday, Aug 29, 2007 at 23:59
John,

We all have jokes and jibes at friends who own different brands to each of us, but lately Nissan seem to have given up on customer support by what most seem to be reporting.

Having driven through a few places with you and Heather, and seen the way you take care of Moses, I am very sorry to hear Nissan have left you with a deflated bank account, and as you have written not supported you with "failing the spirit of the agreement."

Nissan must surely be scaring droves of people away from their product with the amount that has been written here and in other forums.
AnswerID: 259498

Reply By: Sand Man (SA) - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 02:25

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 02:25
Mate,

Sounds like a case for the Department of Fair Trading to me.
Let this Government Agency fight your battle for you.

These mongrels flog an extended warranty to you then renege on coverage of the vehicle.

Too often we hear of this sort of crap from this sort of Company. (must be careful I don't bring ethnics into it, so I won't, didn't, nup)

Is there any "fine print" in the extended warranty that would get them out of such warranty coverage?

Stick it to them John.
Bill


I'm diagonally parked in a parallel Universe!

Member
My Profile  My Blog  My Position  Send Message

AnswerID: 259507

Reply By: Member - Phil G (SA) - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 07:31

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 07:31
Gday John,
I was wondering how you'd got on.

Thats got to be one of the worst instances of a company not honouring warranty. I know of cases where diff breakages are denied because of previous work on the diff (like fitting aftermarket locker) but I can't see how Nissan could possibly look you in the eye and deny you warranty.

I must admit to hating warranties - can't wait until it runs out, so I can freely do what I like to my vehicles, and not have to suck up to someone with no mechanical knowledge behind the service counter, who is getting directed by some faceless individual in their head office. I had a similar experience to yours in 2001 with a Prado - took 10 weeks of grief and no vehicle before it was sorted.

Hope it gets sorted
Cheers
Phil
AnswerID: 259515

Follow Up By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 08:00

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 08:00
G'day Phil,
I too hate warranties......or should I say, I have very little faith in them. This got to the point that with my 2000 GU I bought new, I didn't bother trying to "live-within" the warranty confines. I did all (bar one.....see below) regular maintenance myself and added a "few" aftermarket items as deemed desirable.
However, my one and only brush with warranty came about quite by accident and had a happy ending.
The one occasion when I did get Nissan to do a service for me (cos I'd just moved here to SA and didn't have a lot of my tools, ramps etc), they detected a probable fault with 5th gear (which I knew nothing about). It was still going okay at the time with about 88,000klm on the clock and Nissan's local workshop manager OFFERRED to do the repair under warranty.
That was a good result, but more a case of the local bloke doing the right thing, rather than the corporation.

Cheers

Roachie
0
FollowupID: 521004

Follow Up By: Member - Phil G (SA) - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 08:26

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 08:26
I'm with you Roachie. I service our vehicles from new. Gives me peace of mind, which counts for a lot when you're in the middle of the desert. I use only genuine parts, coolant, brake fluid and most lubricants because they're the best. If I were to have a warranty issue where servicing may have been a factor, then I'd take that on the chin.

Toyota have been very good with the recalls. There have been two of these on my 79series done efficiently and without question by CMI.
0
FollowupID: 521013

Follow Up By: Member - JohnR (Vic)&Moses - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 10:33

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 10:33
Thanks for your comments guys. The very failure to back ones warranty is showing you no longer hold faith in your product. That then impacts on your customer base, doing the same to them - bringing about a lack of faith and hence goodwill.
0
FollowupID: 521016

Reply By: Footloose - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 07:37

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 07:37
Seems like an open and shut case. They are in breach of contract i.e. the extended warrenty. You might like to contact Nissan head office in Japan with your concerns, as well as taking legal action of some form.
AnswerID: 259516

Reply By: Outnabout David (SA) - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 07:55

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 07:55
John,

How peed of you must be but good to see you will now buy a TOYota.!

Seriously though I think you would have some further avenue on this one. They have told you it is not a manufacturing fault so what are thy saying is the cause. Are they saying it was driver abuse?

The warranty is that actually a Nissan policy or is it an extended policy sold by the dealer.

After 30n years working with the good brand of 4WD I saw a lot of crappy extended warranties which had exclusion clauses everywhere but when they brought in the Toyota one we never really had any problems with them except for heavily modified vehicles and then really it was up to the dealer to consider whether this was a contributing factor.

As for the fact they may be suggesting owner abuse well the fact is you i was driving behind you when it happened in low first with the brakes on 'cos you were going so damn slow.

I think it worth having a bit more of a look at different avenues. So of these bastards will do anything they can to get out of a claim... especially a big one. Sometimes it is the little weedy claims clerk that is the problem too not the insurance co itself.

Hope you have better luck and get some reimburesement.

Of topic but I am going back up to waraweena to test the camper axle in a 4 weeks so hopefully that won't come back on the flatbed like it did last time.
AnswerID: 259519

Follow Up By: Member - Peter R (QLD) - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 08:26

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 08:26
If you are a member of a motoring organisation (RACQ Iin Qld) I would be contacting their legal department , to take up on my behalf

Pedro
0
FollowupID: 521012

Follow Up By: Leroy - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 21:04

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 21:04
that warranty is the one sold by nissan and underwritten by swan insurance. it's supposed to be an exact extension of the origial factory warranty.

Leroy
0
FollowupID: 521095

Reply By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 08:18

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 08:18
G'day John,
I'm so sorry that it has had to come to this. It's time likes these that you can be forgiven for considering going over to the dark side.......just remember that if you DO buy a Toyota, you will be in dubious ownership company......(the likes of Lucky, Des, Nudie, Pesty, Outnbout David, Muddy etc)........ the list just goes on and on. Just keep a mental picture of those poor sorry mongrels in the back of your mind if/when you DO sign-up for a 2nd class 4x4.

Sorry, just trying to make light of an otherwise serious issue.

Seriously, if warranty was the main concern when buying your next 4x4, then Nissan would have to be on the bottom of your wishlist. However, bitter though the pill may be, try to bear in mind that yours is (as far as I know) the first reported instance of this type of failure. As such, you'd have to be the unluckiest bloke in the country to buy another Nissan and suffer the same fate.

Like I said in my follow-up (above), I have an inherent dislike and distrust of warranties in general and wouldn't like to rely on one. It's funny that when I had my 5th gear done at 88,000klm, the service manager (great bloke) asked me whether I'd like to pay $950- or so for an extended warranty. I said I'd think about it over the 3 days that they had the vehicle in the workshop. Once I got it back with no $$$ to pay, I politely told him that I'd decided not to get the extended warranty. That was the best $950- I've never spent. haha

Cheers mate

Roachie
AnswerID: 259524

Follow Up By: Des Lexic - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 11:28

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 11:28
I just need to make one point of correction in the above Roachie,
It is US who are on the BRIGHT side and YOUR on the DARK side.
Now John has seen the light and is UPgrading to the TOYOTA and one can only admire him for having the fortitude to lay his heart and sole out in the open and admit to his prior errors of judgement.
Have a lovely day Bill LOL
0
FollowupID: 521026

Reply By: Willem - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 08:48

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 08:48
G'day Bro

I can't offer any advice on this one as I never trust warranties or insurance policies, for that matter.

I have defended Nissan in the past when accusations of non fair trading have sprung up on this forum but it would appear that they do have a poor bedside manner when it comes to aftersales service. We had 2 recalls on the Xtrail which were handled aptly by the local dealer in Port Pirie. The warranty expired ten months ago. Later I became aware, via this forum, of a potential problem with an engine part on the Xtrail and we decided to remedy the potential failure of the part by having it repaired at our own cost rather than having to fight Nissan for expensive compensation later on.

i think that you may just have been unlucky with the diff failure. There are so many variables with these modern cars. I had a LSD differential fail on a TOYOTA I owned which then(1987) only cost a mere $500 to repair. Luckily the dealer had to pay under a limited warranty(2nd hand vehicle) which he was obligated by law to adhere to. The problem was that the WRONG oil had been put in the diff when the vehicle was serviced by the car dealer.

Cheers

AnswerID: 259532

Follow Up By: Member - JohnR (Vic)&Moses - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 16:13

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 16:13
Bro, never been knocked back on an insurance claim. Have a good relationship with the company we work with, Australian owned and related to Bunnings Wesfarmers Federation Insurance

Insurance isn't for getting windfalls it is for risk management as is extending a warranty.
0
FollowupID: 521060

Reply By: montana - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 10:16

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 10:16
some of the fine print in the extended warranty leaves a lot of grey areas,a few years ago i had several toyotas that in my opinion would covered ,they declined and where well in time and km
AnswerID: 259537

Reply By: Mikee5 (QLD) - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 12:46

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 12:46
Here is my interpretation of the above:

Nissan sell you an extended warranty.
Something breaks.
Nissan says your vehicle has travelled too far for it to be a manufacturing defect.

It would seem they are on a big winner here.
They only sell the warranty to ‘old’ vehicles.
If nothing breaks they keep the cash, if something breaks they don’t pay because the vehicle is too old.

How can Nissan lose?
AnswerID: 259548

Reply By: Olcoolone- Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 13:01

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 13:01
It seems Australian is a little out of date with vehicle repair claims.

We have in our workshop a 2003 Honda CRV with just under 95,000k, the people are up for a $2000.00 repair bill at this stage.

The problem with this vehicle is uncommon in other brands but in the CRV,s it is common.

In America Honda will repair the vehicles for nothing with some dating back to 2000, here in Australia they want nothingh to do with it and say there is no known problem.

Holden's 1978 VB to 1984 VH Commodores have a issue with cracking the drivers side floor pan, Holden's still warrant the repair.

The laws here in Australia need to be looked at.

Regards Richard
AnswerID: 259550

Reply By: Truckster (Vic) - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 14:17

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 14:17
Why do people use Nissan and Warranty on the same internet... ???

the more I read about it, the less I would expect it to do bleep .

Shame you didnt get a quote, the gears are on ebay for Possibly 1/23098023948023948th what nissan would charge.
AnswerID: 259558

Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 14:19

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 14:19
Ps. Not Good Enough want you to register now just to search or view..

thanks but I'll stay spam free thanks
0
FollowupID: 521048

Follow Up By: Member - Andrew (QLD) - Friday, Aug 31, 2007 at 16:19

Friday, Aug 31, 2007 at 16:19
"Ps. Not Good Enough want you to register now just to search or view.. "

Yep, Not good enough!

Andrew
0
FollowupID: 521191

Reply By: Member - Brian H (QLD) - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 14:59

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 14:59
Sorry to hear this is the outcome of the damage.

I can say I would not simply take this as a lesson learnt (not saying you are), Maybe contact fair trading, ACCC, consumer affairs, motor body group in Vic and see what they say.

Hope you get some satifaction in the end.

Brian

AnswerID: 259562

Reply By: Member No 1- Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 16:42

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 16:42
"the vehicle was old and had travelled too far for the extended warranty to work for us and we would have to pay for the repairs."...is that actually spelled out in the extended warranty documents?

are you sure that they are not refering to the standard warranty bit?

I also believe that extended warranties are not much of bargain...they usually require you have the maintenance work at the dealer. and generally only cover stuff that BREAKS...which your diff has clearly done.....( not wear and tear stuff...engine bearings may be stuffed due to wear, but are not broken and in which case are not covered should you require them replaced)

take em to the cleaners
AnswerID: 259568

Reply By: Mr Fawlty - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 17:23

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 17:23
Ahhhhhhhhhhhh seems as I recall the charming and delightfull Hellen Wellings from Choice saying these warranties were in general not worth the paper they were written on......The warranties that require you to use a specific product to avoid voiding the Warranty are in NSW & the ACT illegal though convincing the sellers of this may take some doing.
CAVEAT EMPTOR
AnswerID: 259574

Reply By: The Landy - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 17:31

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 17:31
A godd point raised is whether the extended warranty is a Nissan product oer underwritten by someone else...

Like others I have used a Landrover specialist for my vehicles rather than the Landrover dealers...but can understand the annoyance especially given the service history.
AnswerID: 259576

Reply By: The Landy - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 17:31

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 17:31
A good point raised is whether the extended warranty is a Nissan product oer underwritten by someone else...

Like others I have used a Landrover specialist for my vehicles rather than the Landrover dealers...but can understand the annoyance especially given the service history.
AnswerID: 259577

Reply By: Leroy - Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 21:18

Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 at 21:18
It makes me ill reading this as i recently purchased the exact same policy after very much deliberation and consutation with the dealer. Also a mate had the 2yr version which expired recently and got his money worth. I don't know how nissan can say
'Nissan Service department the assistant said that the vehicle is old and had travelled too far for it to be a manufacturing fault'

regardless it's still within the parameters of the warranty. 150k kms or the 3+3yrs of the warranty. I purchased the same exteded warranty becasue I will be doing a Kimberly trip in the not to distant future. This was discussed at length with the dealer I use. Hopefully I don't have to call on Nissan for their help.

I definitely won't be buying another Nissan again. Even though I have sucessfully made warranty claims, I have had to fight tooth and nail every time regardless if it's something as cheap as a switch or as expensive as the gearbox I had replaced. I hope you are reading/listening Mr Nissan.

Leroy
AnswerID: 259605

Reply By: Member - Davoe (Nullagine) - Friday, Aug 31, 2007 at 15:37

Friday, Aug 31, 2007 at 15:37
What you have here is the classic deny every claim policy
it works like this deny every claim
out of 100 legitimite claims denied 90 people challange it and before any extra cost is incurred they fix it
HOWEVER
10 people just go darn thats a pity and walk away
Its easy money for them, all it takes is a bit of persusion
Bilbo recently found a simular thing whith his 100 when it was stolen they offer you a ridiculous low figure 90% of people challange it and get (closer) to what they deserve and 10% walk away happy with what they got
They know they are wrong and it wont stack up to any challange so it wont take much persuasion
AnswerID: 259732

Sponsored Links

Popular Products (9)