Lift Kits

Submitted: Saturday, May 24, 2003 at 10:31
ThreadID: 5099 Views:2722 Replies:5 FollowUps:20
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Some 4WD owners may not be aware of the National Vehicle Regulations regarding the safety issues of 4WD vehicles fitted with lift kits & their implications
on insurance policies. New regulations only allow a maximum of 50mm & if you exceed this there is a requirement (at the owners expense) of a lane-change test
to prove that the vehicle's centre of gravity has not been altered to a degree that it
is unsafe to drive. This test entales hiring a qualified driver to carry out the test at a suitable venue & an engineer to certify that the vehicle is safe & the cost of around $2000 to have this test carried out .Have Wheels Will Travel
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Reply By: Allyn (Pilbara) - Saturday, May 24, 2003 at 12:08

Saturday, May 24, 2003 at 12:08
I believe the maxumim is 75 mm and this is inclusive of all options (suspension, tyres, bodylift).
I've opted to decline on the insurance option which means that I now only have to concern myself if the local plods get interested. Given that they're probably going to be in the 19-25 bracket and armed with minimal knowledge then I think I'll be okay.
Can you imagine how accommodating insurance companies would be if suddenly they had to chase us for business?
The only lane I've got to change into is the one coming the other way too so I can't see any engineer performing this test.
Do you reckon their insurance would cover you if they flipped your vehicle on it's side whilst doing the lane change test?
Isn't it funny how you can put a roof rack on top, possibly even fit hungry boards, then load it to the hilt and drive off quite legally (within reason) yet the centre of gravity is altered dramatically.

In here - thinking of out there !!!
AnswerID: 20932

Follow Up By: Member - Topcat - Saturday, May 24, 2003 at 14:36

Saturday, May 24, 2003 at 14:36
I do believe that your vehicle can be knocked back for being unroadworthy if you happened to get pulled over for whatever reason & a yellow sticker applied until the vehicle is certified roadworthy. At least that is what the W.A. Transport Authority are legislating.Have Wheels Will Travel
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Follow Up By: diamond(bendigo) - Saturday, May 24, 2003 at 17:21

Saturday, May 24, 2003 at 17:21
hi all.
in victoria the maximum is 50mm lift for roadworthy requirements.
looking foward to september(landcruiser park/fraser island)
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Follow Up By: GaryInOz (Vic) - Saturday, May 24, 2003 at 19:21

Saturday, May 24, 2003 at 19:21
If you do a bodylift, springlift, and fit larger wheels, with engineers cert covering all mods simultaneously, are you OK? (in Victoria) Even if it is a total in excess of 50mm?
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Follow Up By: Allyn (Pilbara) - Saturday, May 24, 2003 at 23:12

Saturday, May 24, 2003 at 23:12
Yellow stickers and roadworthiness would be reliant on there actually being any coppers around to ping you. Now that god created the ubiquitous cameras, the old patrol car is really a thing of the past wouldn't you think? I understand all the legalities and will take my chances believing that as long as one is not too radical then no trouble shall be incurred. It's all a bit petty really and I just wish the bastards would catch all the low lifes that are stealing from us good folks instead of fining us for anything and everything they can think of.
Can't see annual inspections happening in WA either as it's just too big a place and the Govt doesn't have the resources or finances to enforce that particular nightmare.
Just my thoughts and I enjoy your contributions
cheersIn here - thinking of out there !!!
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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 16:35

Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 16:35
My engineers for my 6inch lift and 33's cost $300, dont know where you get $2000 from.

Your engineer drives a lamborgini ? ;)

Gary, if you TEL () the engineer that is all the mods you are doing, he CHECKS ALL the mods, then passes them all, then if your insurance company accepts them, you go to Vicroads and tell them, as they have to modify your cars details, then yes you SHOULD be covered.
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Follow Up By: GaryInOz (Vic) - Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 20:26

Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 20:26
Thanks Truckster...
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Follow Up By: Old Jack - Monday, May 26, 2003 at 14:34

Monday, May 26, 2003 at 14:34
Eventually WA and other states will have to fall into line with the rest of the states as "Uniform" National legislation will eventualy come into place, the same as heavy vehical licences have ended up under a national scheme, as for the state's not having the finanaces to do it they collect registration each year plus the "USER PAYS" for the inspection each year. and the system of inspection is basically done by certified inspection stations (motor mechanics after a training course) that is randomly audited.
Anual inspection in NSW includes a brake effort test, soon will require an emision test. A lot of car's let alone 4WD will fail the emmision standards test once they come into place, they have in all fairness held off the emmision test for a number of years. as for the break test, a lot of the old 4 wheel drum Landies and Toyotas are borderline.

consider yourselves lucky (or if you are hit by one of the Bomb's left on the road due to lack of inspection Unlucky)
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Follow Up By: Member - Shawn - Thursday, May 29, 2003 at 15:09

Thursday, May 29, 2003 at 15:09
Allyn
Don't you think 3rd Party in your rego (it is registered isn't it) would be void if you are running a illegal vehicle.
You hurt or kill someone, man you will hang, for compensation and manslaughter.
Just something before you think about a little more before you try a pull the wool over the young coppers up thereKeep your powder dry
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Follow Up By: Allyn (Pilbara) - Thursday, May 29, 2003 at 15:25

Thursday, May 29, 2003 at 15:25
Shawn
Firstly I haven't killed anyone in weeks and in 35 years of driving (since aged 6) have never been involved in an accident that was caused by myself.
Secondly If I was the only bloke in a Landcruiser getting around with a 2" lift kit and Mud Terrains (hardly radical) then that would be something different. I only raised my vehicle's suspension by 50mm as that was considered legal but now they want to go and change it all.
Thirdly I'm not trying to pull the wool over any coppers eyes, I'm just saying that you don't see them on the roads anymore other than for RBT's.
All in all it's a calculated risk that I am prepared to take. I may reassess if I relocate to the big smoke but for now that's my lot.
I respect your point of view but I'm fed up with having to comply to pathetic rules made up by do-gooders and minority lobby groups who wouldn't know how to enjoy themselves in a month full of friday nights !
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Follow Up By: Member - Shawn - Thursday, May 29, 2003 at 15:42

Thursday, May 29, 2003 at 15:42
Allyn,
1. Glad your on the straight and narrow now
2. Point taken
3. OK, country coppers are far fewer than in the city (Sydney) we see and hear them more often than you run into them at RBTs
a. I'm no do gooder but I know where your coming from
b. minority/adverse groups do seem to rule
c. I'd rather be up there (Broome) as well :)
take careKeep your powder dry
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Reply By: Old Jack - Saturday, May 24, 2003 at 20:37

Saturday, May 24, 2003 at 20:37
Yes Once again "ROAD WORTHYNESS" comes back into the picture.
Under the laws in most states you are braking the law buy fitting a set of tyres that increase the overall diameter by more than 25mm, or width by 25mm over that stated on the tyre placard on the car or manufactures handbook. A lot of people have done this for years and because nothing has been done in the past thinks they are fine. Then when the get a sticker spew because they have done so for years. in NSW they inspect cars yearly for road worthyness, some of the other states vehicals go for years with out inspection! Feeling lucky everyone ???
as for loading a vehcial, there are a few laws that cover the the restraint of a load, if you put any weight on top of a cars roof that exceeds the manufactures load limmit of the roof or fail to suffiecently restrain the load you can get on the spot fine & be orderd off the road untill the load is corrected , just like any truck with to much weight over any one axel, the rules apply to all vehcial not just trucks, The RTA in NSW went around testing cars towing trailers(caravans etc.) a while ago at a spot on the Pacific HWY. they put the lot over scales(tow vehicals included), check condition of wheel bearings etc. should have seen the row of failed vans & trailers! State revenew went well that week!
AnswerID: 20950

Follow Up By: tristjo - Saturday, May 24, 2003 at 22:28

Saturday, May 24, 2003 at 22:28
I know in Queensland that the rolling diameter of a tyre can be increased up to 50mm over the largest, factory fitted tyre for that specific vehicle.
Tristjo.
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Follow Up By: diamond(bendigo) - Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 10:46

Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 10:46
in victoria you cant go over 15mm increase in diamater over the lagest tyre stated on the tyre placard.ps tyre placard is also a roadworthy item.
looking foward to september(landcruiser park/fraser island)
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Reply By: Member - Royce- Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 00:54

Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 00:54
I only worry about third party property insurance for when I hit a $100,000 + car and bounce into a $500,000 house. If the bruised recipients want a payout then they had better not go on too much about what size tyres I have or how high the beastie looks!

I'm a nice middle-aged bloke who doesn't speed. The cops chase my son instead.Royce www.funshow.com.au
AnswerID: 20973

Reply By: Flesh - Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 06:40

Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 06:40
I've been trying to find out what's legal here and what isn't. The reason I'm doing this is because I purchased a 80LC in December from a Toyota Dealer here in Qld. '95 GXL 4.2 NA Diesel. Mainly to tow a caravan around Oz with a bit of ruff stuff without he van. Has all the acessories that we require but as I dicovered after taking delivery the vehicle has about a 75mm lift.

The vehicle was insured and all mods advised to the insurer except the unknown lift. The vehicle was supplied with the Qld safety certificate and no mention was made by the dealer of the lift that I beleive may be illegal under Qld law as Qld transport tell me that a lift may not exceed 1/3rd of the standard bump rubber height. i.e if the distance between the bump rubber is standard at 100mm it cannot exceed 133mm when lifted.

My question here is "Does the dealer have a duty of care to make this vehicle comply to local laws or is it a case of Cavat Emptor (let the buyer beware)?"
AnswerID: 20977

Follow Up By: Member - Topcat - Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 11:28

Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 11:28
Hi Flesh, you have an interesting argument there where insurance lawyers may use it as a "Loop Hole" to get out of a claim. What brought me to bring up this subject was an article in yesterday's (24th May) Western Australian (Motoring Section) Newspaper which quotes :
' A spokes person for the Department of Transport said driving a 4WD that has been modified without undergoing the necessary safety tests was akin to driving an unroadworthy vehicle.
He said that if the car was involved in an accident, it would not be covered by insurance if the insurance company could show the modification contributed to the accident' unquote. This opens up a big can of worms and because our vehicles are worth a lot of money & we pay high premiums in insurance policies. All the insurance company needs is a viable excuse not to pay up even when you are not to blame for the accident. Cheers.Have Wheels Will Travel
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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 16:38

Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 16:38
I think if he sold you the vehicle as "ROADWORTHY" then he has to ensure that it is. If not then who ever gave the Roadworthy Cert is in some deep bleep , if the car isnt.

I know thats how works in NSW and Vic, cant see why its different.
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Follow Up By: Member - Topcat - Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 20:51

Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 20:51
Hey Truckster, I'm only going on what was commented on by the WA 4WD Association & what is being legislated here in W.A. & as for the $2000 owners cost was that the venue would have to be probably a closed race track to hold the test. This was quoted in Saturdays Western Australian newspaper. I would be very interested to see what insuance companies in the Eastern States have to say about the vehicle modification clause in their policies because I know first hand that the RACWA are specific on it. Have a nice day. Cheers.Have Wheels Will Travel
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Follow Up By: Member - Topcat - Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 21:05

Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 21:05
Further to my last comment. There are very few (if not any) from enquiries I have made here in W.A. motor vehicle engineers who will certify modifications to 4WD motor vehicles because of the difficulties involved in testing them when it comes to upgrading load capacities & suspension modifications. If anybody does know of one in the Perth metro area I for one would like to know. I have tried all the engineers supplied from the list given out by the Motor Transport Department without much success. Cheers.Have Wheels Will Travel
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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 21:26

Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 21:26
If you dont know him, contact Mick Barson, and ask him, he "SHOULD" know LOL

Micks Homepage

He runs the Perth offroad forum, also has a website with a few 100 links ;)

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Follow Up By: Member - Topcat - Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 22:04

Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 22:04
Thanks Truckster, I'll give him a try. By the way when are you signing up to be a member? Dave & Michelle need all the help they can get to run this web site. Cheers.Have Wheels Will Travel
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Follow Up By: Not a Member - Truckster (Vic) - Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 22:22

Sunday, May 25, 2003 at 22:22
I have no reason to be a member. Im not going to be buying anything soon, so have no need to be. As I said before, Id rather donate $50 to the starlight foundation, I would get more out of that.

If my posting information, and other stuff is not seen as good enough, then so be it... bleep happens.

If it goes to a limit of 3 posts before you have to become a member this place will die. Simple fact, but then I see the easy way around it to bleep tin the forum. There are 109832104982039480239-32480983204's of othes out there. If you get a woody from having MEMBER-NAME remember you can just add Member to your name for free, it works!
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Reply By: Allyn (Pilbara) - Wednesday, May 28, 2003 at 11:48

Wednesday, May 28, 2003 at 11:48
Some info I received last week initially from a WA 4WD Association representative
****************

Things are in a state of limbo at the moment with the DPI still considering lifting the limit for suspension modification to 75mm.

At the moment the situation is
The LAW is that no modifications can be made to a vehicle that change it from the manufacturer's specifications.

The POLICY is :-
Professionally installed lifts up to 50mm will be approved and a permit issued upon inspection. (Lift includes suspension, body and rolling radius of the wheels)

Lifts between 50-75mm must have a vehicle modification application completed and in many instances will have to undergo a lane change test.

All vehicles with a lift of greater than 75mm must undergo the lane change test unless an identical vehicle has already passed the test.

The lane change test (which I have details) is not a reasonable test in the opinion of the Association and it is most unlikely any 4WD would be able to pass it.

Further meetings are to be held with the DPI Technical section in an attempt to find a reasonable solution but have not been scheduled yet.

One the situation is finalised, the WA4WDA is hoping to arrange for a day at Quit Motorplex to fast track suspension permits an reduce cost to individual vehicle owners.

AnswerID: 21280

Follow Up By: Ferret - Friday, May 30, 2003 at 02:21

Friday, May 30, 2003 at 02:21
I've been hanging on this for a while as I need to purchase new suspension for my 95GQ. I would really like to go 3 inch so if you hear anything in the next few weeks could you please let me know otherwise it will be a run-of-the-mill 2 inch(yawn)
Thanks Scott
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