Tyre Price Fixing?

Submitted: Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 08:18
ThreadID: 74259 Views:5559 Replies:15 FollowUps:17
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Well ringing around for prices for new tyres I got told a interesting bit of info from a Mickey Thompson dealer and a Cooper Dealer; they are told by MT and Cooper respectively at what price to sell a tyre for. If they are found discounting the price below that of what they are told, they run the risk of losing their license to sell MT or Cooper tires. Surely this practice is anti-competitive and hence illegal in Australia, has anyone else heard this?

P.S. $370 for 285/75R16 MT MTZ's and you can't buy Goodyear MTR's anymore, ouch!

Cheers

Snowy
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Reply By: Member - Tour Boy ( Bundy QLD) - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 08:53

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 08:53
BFG's are cheaper in that size anyway. I shopped around and had a difference of $40 per tyre

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Dave
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AnswerID: 394170

Reply By: Phil and Sue - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 09:00

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 09:00
I also shopped around for the Cooper STT 265/75/16's and found a small difference. Got them for $350.

Phil
AnswerID: 394171

Reply By: Time - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 09:03

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 09:03
Has been the practice for quite some time on MTs I believe.

I did a deal with my friendly local distributer that showed I paid full wack for the tyres but got a HUGE discount on the wheels I bought at the same time!

But yes, I would have thought that setting rrp was OK, but stopping a reseller from discounting is a bit sus.
AnswerID: 394172

Reply By: paulnsw - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 09:06

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 09:06
Why pay high prices for their marketing. To make matters worse you are paying top dollar as they have not reduced prices with the high Aussie dollar. Prices should have come down 25%. Personally I would not use either brand as I don't like to make myself look like a wacker that is sucked in by marketing and advertising for disgustingly high prices. Compare the US price and see how you are getting hugely ripped off.
AnswerID: 394173

Follow Up By: Shaker - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 09:27

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 09:27
"Compare the US price and see how you are getting hugely ripped off."

For a sub-standard tyre!

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FollowupID: 662407

Reply By: Notso - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 09:32

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 09:32
ACCC Re Retail price Maintenance

Have a look here. I think you are correct about there being laws against that sort of thing
AnswerID: 394180

Follow Up By: DIO - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 14:13

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 14:13
I just don't think that you are correct, I know that you are correct. Conspiring or colluding to fix prices is against the law.
Don't you recall a short time back there was an investigation into petrol pricing and suggestions that there was price fixing within the industry. Think findings fail to establish evidence of proof.
What about Richard Pratt of Visy Packaging. He was found to have engaged in price fixing and was fined $35 million. He even returned his Officer of Australia Award because of the 'conviction'.
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FollowupID: 662440

Reply By: Mr Pointyhead - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 09:40

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 09:40
Why not send in a complaint to ACCC ?

ACCC Online Complaint Page
AnswerID: 394181

Follow Up By: Snowy 3.0iTD - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 10:11

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 10:11
Thanks for the link, I have done just that, will wait and see what happens.

Snowy
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FollowupID: 662414

Reply By: Member - Phil G (SA) - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 09:55

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 09:55
Last time I priced Coopers it was about 8 years ago. Every dealer I enquired at quoted the same price - $288 for a Cooper ST 265/75/16. I asked one guy whether I could get a discount for quantity etc, and he quietly said what you said - he'd lose his licence to sell them if he discounted. I have no idea whether that is still the case - I'd guess things have changed.
AnswerID: 394183

Reply By: Steve63 - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 10:25

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 10:25
I think you will find that the companies are within their rights to set the retail prices in this way. It is more common than you think. Apple and Miele are two other companies that do this. The price setting is a contract condition. The dealers can choose to not sell those brands. It is not anti competative as it is one company and there are many other companies that supply equivalent products. If MT and Coopers's had an arrangement that would be anti competative. If Cooper's and MT were the only suppliers of tyres that would be an oligololy and subject to further restrictions under Australian law.

Any discounts you see are manufacturer discounts, there is no reseller discounting. You can get other services as part of the deal though. The manufacturer is using a service delivery model that is quite common in many industries. They are producing a situation where you can go to any dealer and get their product at basically the same price. Some people prefer this, and many companies see it as desirable.

If you don't like it vote with your feet and buy something else.

Steve
AnswerID: 394189

Follow Up By: Notso - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 10:38

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 10:38
This is an extract from the ACCC Site.

"Resale price maintenance can occur when a supplier requires resellers to not advertise or sell below a specified price," ACCC Chairman, Mr Graeme Samuel, said today.

"It can also occur where a supplier induces, or attempts to induce, its resellers from discounting their stock or where the supplier withholds, or threatens to withhold, stock when resellers sell or attempt to sell their product at a price lower than the price set by the supplier.
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FollowupID: 662418

Follow Up By: Member - joc45 (WA) - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 11:14

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 11:14
I recall Toyota in WA have been done twice in the past for price-fixing of some of their vehicle models.

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FollowupID: 662422

Follow Up By: Steve63 - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 11:18

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 11:18
Yes correct for a reseller. I think you will find that the tyre dealers are agents and hence act at the direction of the company they are providing the service too. Have you seen anyone discounting postage stamps or bus tickets?

Steve
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FollowupID: 662423

Follow Up By: Notso - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 12:11

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 12:11
That's certainly not the case with Franchisees who you would think would be fairly well tied up contractually.

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FollowupID: 662428

Follow Up By: Member - Stephen L (Clare SA) - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 14:32

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 14:32
Hi Steve
I would just like to clarify one issue, and that is Miele. We sell their products at work and I can never speak highly enough of their first rate quality product.

The difference here with Miele and other products can not be compared. It does not matter where in Australia you buy a Miele product, it is the same price. Why??

The stores that sell Miele products are only agents, do not buy the product, but sell it on behalf of Miele. Miele have a price list, and that is the price that the end customer must pay. As all Miele orders are all done over the internet, the price is their in black and white and we can not change it and all monies goes direct to Miele and not the agent. So if a particular store has thousands of dollars of Miele stock on hand, all cost are worn by Miele Australia and that store has not outlayed one dollar in stock.

I hope this clears the Miele issue

Cheers

Stephen
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FollowupID: 662442

Follow Up By: Steve63 - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 14:42

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 14:42
Yes that is correct. I think you will find I said the same thing in a reply already. And you will find the signs for Coopers say they are an agent.

I am not saying that Miele or Apple are not good products (I have multiple examples of both at home). In fact I am saying the opposite. I am saying it is a way of providing a customer service. That type of delivery model is basically transparent to the end purchaser as it should be. It is just a different delivery ideal.

Steve
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FollowupID: 662447

Reply By: steve21 - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 12:30

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 12:30
i just purchased BFG M/T in that size, difference in price $90 per tyre from 4X4 shop to tyre retailer in same suburb! tyre retailer got my business
cheers Steve
AnswerID: 394205

Follow Up By: Snowy 3.0iTD - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 12:32

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 12:32
Old or new tread pattern, as I rang Bob Jane's hoping BFG MT's might be a bit cheaper, got told $379 a tyre?

Snowy
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FollowupID: 662431

Follow Up By: steve21 - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 15:15

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 15:15
Hi Snowy
new KM2 - $320 each - you in sydney? try tempe tyres cheers steve
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FollowupID: 662450

Reply By: olcoolone - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 15:02

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 15:02
If you were Mr Thompson or Cooper you to would be protecting your interests.

You will find even that this practice is illegal most consumer products are the same.

The distributor can not tell you what to sell for but if you do the right thing by them there are other incentives involved like advertising, rebates, sign age and a range of other things.

What the distributors will do is if your a reseller and you don't follow suit is make you life difficult or restrict some aspects.

Getting something cheaper is programmed into people from an early age and they think if they don't get some sort of discount then they are getting ripped off....perhaps it comes from the hunting instinct that humans have where they want to win or have the upper hand over someone or something.

We don't discount and never will due to the fact I want to make money and I want to pay my staff well and offer our customers the best service.

Think of it this way, if you worked for a company and you were getting paid $30 per hour and the boss came in and said we are going to discount everything we sell but I still want to make my bottom line....how about we cut your pay by 20% to help me stay in business.

I'm sure you would be more them happy to help him out....all for the sake of the customers.

I'm sure most people don't understand the real costs of a business.

If you sold a product for $400 and you marketed it as a premium product whereby all the oppositions products were cheaper by lowering your price below theirs is sending a message that your product is not as good as theirs and by doing so you have removed the premium persona attached to it.

There is a simple answer don't by the Coopers and by something cheaper.



The other thing is try a Cooper dealer and not a reseller...why.....We wanted some Toyo M/T's for our 4x4 and went to the tyre place who we deal with through our business for tyres for our vehicles....they are a Toyo reseller and quoted us $437 a tyre so we phoned around and spoke to a Toyo dealer who knew nothing about our other vehicles and quoted $386 a tyre.
AnswerID: 394214

Follow Up By: Snowy 3.0iTD - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 15:22

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 15:22
olcoolone

What you are forgetting though is the free market economy. If store A sells the same product for 10% cheaper than store B, then more customers will buy from store A. Sure store A makes a lower margin on each unit, but if they have done their homework correctly, they sell a lot more which still enable them to pay their fixed overheads and make the larger overall profit. If this continues Store B goes out of business.

If a store/business can't please their customers, retain the existing ones and attract new ones then soon they won't be in business, simple. At the end of the day, any business that want's to remain profitable, has to have it's customers as it's top priority, they are after all what generate money for the business to be able to pay the workers wages.

Cheers

Snowy
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FollowupID: 662451

Follow Up By: olcoolone - Wednesday, Dec 09, 2009 at 12:32

Wednesday, Dec 09, 2009 at 12:32
How true...but in the world of business it's in the best interests of the retailer to keep profit margins high.

And because someone sells something cheap doesn't always mean the customer is getting the best bargain.

We use to sell Waeco fridges and we still are a dealer, we stopped why....we could buy a Waeco cheaper at the large camping chain stores.

So instead of dealing with someone who had knowledge, uses the fridges, can help out with fitments and wiring issues, now your stuck with as 20 year old who only knows the price and that they get cold if you connect them to a battery.

Is that customer service....
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FollowupID: 662595

Follow Up By: Snowy 3.0iTD - Wednesday, Dec 09, 2009 at 13:19

Wednesday, Dec 09, 2009 at 13:19
Well that is the flip-side, I myself personally are prepared to pay a bit extra for good service, as an example I will only buy HP computers, simply because their after sales service and technical support is second to none. But how many other people take those sorts of things into consideration.

And when it comes to tyres I get annoyed that manufacturers are enforcing their prices on retailers, I will probably end up paying that price, but if another manufacturer/retailer offered a tyre that is just as good at a cheaper price, then I am going to vote with my wallet.

Snowy
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FollowupID: 662607

Reply By: Member - Lionel A (WA) - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 15:07

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 15:07
There is also the possibility the retailer didnt want to discount or spend time haggling so may have suggested the price fixing excuse as a way of not doing so.
Kind of making it look as though it was out of his hands.

Just a thought.


Cheers.....Lionel.
AnswerID: 394215

Reply By: Charlie - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 16:30

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 16:30
Two retailers agreeing to set their prices at $ 200 a tyre is price fixing and illegal in Australia, the wholesaler dictating to the same two retailers the price will be $ 200 a trye or loose his dealership is unfortunately legal at the moment.
AnswerID: 394225

Reply By: Ross H (QLD) - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 18:04

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 18:04
Snowy
Not true you can get goodyear mtr's they have just changed the tread pattern.
Got two last week and ordered two more. New tread pattern is a lot more agressive than the old one.
Paid $335 a tyre.

Rossco
AnswerID: 394237

Follow Up By: Ross H (QLD) - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 18:07

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 18:07
Sorry Tyre 265/75/16

rossco
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FollowupID: 662474

Follow Up By: Snowy 3.0iTD - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 18:51

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 18:51
Ross

They no longer show the old MTR on the Goodyear Australia website, I spoke to two Goodyear dealers who both said the same thing; the old ones are still available in selected sizes, not in a 285/75 R16, and the new Kevlar MTR has a RRP of $450!.
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FollowupID: 662484

Follow Up By: Ross H (QLD) - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 20:04

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 20:04
Yes these were the new ones as you said could not get the old tread pattern, which is why I got 4 and not two. Mind you the new ones look the goods just hope I get as good of a run out of these as I did the old ones..:)

rossco
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FollowupID: 662493

Reply By: PradOz - Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 22:37

Tuesday, Dec 08, 2009 at 22:37
Suggest you ring around. I got a $29 per tyre saving at the 3rd dealer I rang for Coopers. He like all of the others didnt stock them but had to have them delivered to him the next day. The agent I purchased from is a large reputable one and is very closely located to the others here in south west sydney. cheers....
AnswerID: 394305

Reply By: Snowy 3.0iTD - Wednesday, Dec 09, 2009 at 13:46

Wednesday, Dec 09, 2009 at 13:46
Interesting repsonse from people just checking back through my records,

I bought my last set of MT MTZ's in 285/75 R16 in July 08, height of the world economic boom, a barrel of oil was up around $130-$140 US per barrel, and the Aussie dollar was buying around 70-80 US cents, I paid $325 per tyre.

Fast forward to now, Aussie dollar is buying around 90 US cents, the price of oil is around $70-$80 US per barrel, and the tyres are now $370 each, go figure???
AnswerID: 394370

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