Ok - WHY?

Dunno mate.

In the scheme of things this is one that has never crossed my mind...lol

Hi Crazy Dog
The biggest issue i came up with them when we bought a new vehicle was the resale value (or lack of it!!!) and then the fuel capacity, the power etc. is fine, a mate has just bought one second hand and he loves it (a 3.2 diesels) and the best fuel consumption of all the diesel vehicle of that size, and his last vehicle was a petrol V6 and he says the Paj diesel kills the V6 for towing the CT and everything else and before the V6 he had a falcon ute (2wd) so he has no power withdrawal symptoms YET!!!
If u are buying a second hand 4wd i think they are great vehicles (i probably will get crucified for saying it).

Mattie

Hi Mr Dog,
Are you refering to this site, or in general?I'm from Sydney originally; plenty of paj's there. Perhaps demographics have an influence? Now I'm living rural there is a predominance of 4wd utes and standard spec Nissans and Toyotas.

Go test drive a Pajero then a Cruiser/Patrol and you'll see.
Up here I think there are 2 or 3 in town, simply dont match it.Have heard first hand on three occasions of people who had Pajeros,went for a ride with someone who had a cruiser or patrol and had the Pajero on the market in days.Im not saying they fall apart but the ride is shocking,seats horrible,leak dust etc.
Oh yeah and they get bogged real easy in sand-sorry guys (you know who you are)

From cruising the highways its my observation they are prob the 3rd most popular tow vehicle for small - med - small caravans behind N and T

Too small for me.

I agree see millions of them around town in sydney, mostly by the wife taking kids to school and soccer, The 4wd club I am a member of is dominated by Patrols and Cruisers. One of our members basically got sick of fixing his pajero every time some rough stuff came along, Where as his 80 series seems to bounce of walls and come back for more. just IMHO they are not a serious offroad machine and the dominance of Patrols and Cruisers must back up this claim.

Cheers

I never noticed how many Subie forresters are out there until we get back from our trip..travelled with one and the girl did well (even got up big red and put a few tuff nutters to shame!!! especially with an L plater driving).....

Laura B

I'm not even going to enter this one Crazy ,, offered you ours yesterday for a run ,, you know where we are ,, as for some replys ,, CRAP ,, if you want a big wagon , don't buy one , if you only need a medium one , they are as good as any other in the range !!

Hoo roo ,, Neil !!

I looked at them not long back when i was in the market, liked most things about them apart from looks.
Couldn`t part with 50 plus k for somethin I didnt like the looks of.

Horses for courses - is my humble answer to original post. Hundreds here in Darwin.

I've had 2 Paj's,,, 2.8L gutless diesel 1985 model,,,, and 1993 3L petrol (still have this one ,,, 250K up) and we now have 2005 4.2TD LC79 Ute.

Simple for us ,,,, Paj is far superior in ride and handling, and I agree Cruisers and Patrol can get deeper in the SH** and get out in many instances.

LC79 is for towing a future off road van up to 3tonne ATM. Pajaero won't do it but it has towed 2 boats for 10 years up to 1.2 tonnes quite well.

Hence my statement - Horses for courses.

YOU BUY A VEHICLE FOR THE TASK YOU WANT IT TO DO - DON'T YOU???

Or do you follow brand.

Cheers Barry

The 3.2 DiD engine has only been around for four years - the previous Diesels were pretty ordinary.

When I bought mine 3 years ago I got $8000 off list price - the new Prado had just come out and everyone was buying them. Also no-one was interested in a Pajero Diesel because everyone "knew" they were ordinary.

Reputations take a long time to change - and many buying decisions are based on reputation rather than facts.

The makers did aim Pajeros at a certain market and I guess that has plusses and minuses.

I think that Hyundai will be giving Pajero some competition for the same clientele.

For long country excursions and off tar work we needed size, durability and ready supply of parts and mechanics if needed. Came down to one of the two biggies in the end. Both the biggies will tow reasonable loads confidently and the 4.2td auto Toyota had the edge and suited us.

We bought our NP 3.2DiD earlier this year after a GQ, Jeep Cherokee Sport, GU2.8 and 2 Td5 Discos over 10 years (60k/3yr leases). The Paj is the first that I've seriously considered keeping beyond the lease. BUT...it took a lot of personal courage to buy it - it's still ugly! This probably puts a lot of people off. From the driver's seat though, you dont see the wheel arch bulges.

So far we've been in sand, to the Flinders and into mild Vic high country - it's just kept going. It needs polyairs because the headlights point at the treetops with a full load (I'd fit firmer/taller springs if I didn't have to use an underground carpark).

Looked at a Disco 3 but purchase price was too high & particularly servicing costs are almost half the Disco. Dealer availability is also much better. Accessories are also cheaper (snorkel/2nd battery tray etc and 16" rather than 17/18" tyres).

Adrian

I'm doin' my bit for Mitsubishi :-) On my third one....

Far as I'm concerned, anyone who knocks the Paj simply hasn't given one a decent go.

Plenty around, and they did sell to a particular market, and Mitsubishi seemed to invent that medium 4wd (with reasonable road manners) concept in 1983.
When I traded in the old NB (86 model), I did look at the toyota clone (Prado). I suppose copying some ones idea is a complement.
But ended up with a 2nd pajero for another 10 years since some accessories could be swapped over easily.
This one will last a while yet.

So if you look at the total numbers of Pajs, Prados and the new pathfinder, Mitsubishi did start something. And some people only buy it if it has a toyota or nissan badge on the front. Sorry, just had to say it :o).

==Why is there not more people with Pajero's? ==

I believe that some of the reason is that Toyo and Nisson has had a great marketing campaign for years.......helped by the word of mouth of satisfied owners. It would be very hard for any other manufacturer to break into this market and make any sort of impact on it.

==Is there something about them that make people steer away from them? ==

I would suggest that people who want a hardcore 4wd would be sold on the T & N path. For some, the new look was a turnoff, however i believe that this is now being accepted as the way of the future.......just look at the change in shape of the LC130 and L/Rover being thrown around the forum recently.

==Are they under powered for dragging campatrailers or what..... ==

I comfortably tow my Kimberley Kamper (1200-1500kg, dependant on trip i guess) around with the 3.2 DiD especially over some rough and steep 4wd tracks. I would suspect the petrol alternative wouldn't be as good.

==Would be pleased to hear your comments... ==

I still believe that if you want a "go anywhere" 4wd then stick to the Toyo & Nisson camp, however they are not the best design for all situations. Each to their own i guess.

I would buy another Pajero in a flash as they suit my situation. I agree with MrBitchi in that i normally find that the people who knock them, usually haven't given them a go. They are not for everyone, just the elite few :-)

Andrew

Gotta compare apples to apples. The Pajero isn't a LandCruiser/Patrol - it's competition in the 4WD usage stakes is the Prado and Pathfinder (although I have the impression that the Pathy is a bit smaller inside - maybe the most recent model is bigger). Comparing them to a full size 4WD isn't just - although on the interior, I reckon the Pajero would come close to having the same luggage capacity in the rear.

My biggest criticism of the Pajero (and I own one) is the fuel capacity - the 90L factory tank in the petrol model just doesn't cut it for some of the treks I would like to undertake. The economy of the DiD makes a big difference to the range though for extended touring.

I think we'll find in a few short years there will be very few genuine offroad wagons - everything will move to IFS/IRS, and anyone wanting a near "out of the box" offroader other than a Toyota 95 series will need to look at the ute market for Tritons/Navaras/Hiluxes etc. But for now, my NM will take me everywhere I want to go.

The roof mounted Pajeros have a very low load carrying capacity so if you want a roof rack or boat loader it prevents this option.

So if thinking of carrying anything up top it might be worth checking with Mitsubishi first.

Like every one says there are good and bad points. We fitted ours with some taller springs and that gave it 2 inches as well (could have said 6 :-), Longer reach shocks and suddenly the ride was great and you can load the back up with out the sag. We have fitted a longe range tank, 85 additional litres. Got the dual batteries and all the gear and front diff locks. We have got up some unreal hills and into spots no one else goes. You have to not care to much about a scratch here and there and have the recovery gear to get your self out of trouble.

I think they got a bum rap at the start because of the IFS, now they all have it and they all spin the front wheel off the ground (The locker fixes that)

Give it a go, find some one with one and ask for a drive, you maybe surprised.

Steve

I reckon they are a great car. My NL will go anywhere the so called 'real 4wd's go. To say a live axle Nissan/Toyota handle better is a load of rubbish. Mate just traded his Patrol in for an IFS cruiser & couldnt believe the difference on road. Actually the Patrol does not utilise its interior space all that well, not much bigger than the Paj.

As far is off road is concerned, not too sure about the NM/NP as underbody protection is limited.

If I had my time over again, would still buy the Paj.

I spent nine months searching for the 'right' truck. Drove anything and everything crawled inside, over, under, lifted carpets....... you get the picture. I offered/bid on four vechiles over that time: 98 Prado GXL V6, 1998 Pajero GLS Luxury before finally a 1998 2.8l TD GU Patrol ST and then my December 1998 2.8l GU ST Patrol. As I did the rounds of car yards, auction houses, private sellers and the all the Pajeros I came across bar the one I bid on were absolutely shot. I do believe Pajeros are brilliant cars for the first 200,000km but after that i would not touch them. My good mechanic mate will charge double a service for a pajero than for a toyota/nissan, he said he just keeps finding things to fix. I told him he could have been a rich man if he didn't say this to me and his reply was that if I hadn't know him for donkeys then I would have recieved a different reply.

They are definately not underpowered (2.8l Patrol?????) so this is relative :). From personal experiance the pre IFS pajeros had stability issues big time and are prone to rollover due to thier height and relatively narrow track (to Cruisers/patrol). The one I was in rolled last year coming into lawn Hills Gorge and was a writeoff when a 3.0l Patrol and 2.8l Patol (both towing trailers) had no issue. It was a 1996 GLX 3.5 V6 auto, wasn't speeding, just hit a pothole which kicked the front out, driver overcorrected, hit a small bank, paj rolls three times before landing upside down. 5 people walk without a scratch. Says wonders for thier safety systems but I would have prefered the thing to stay upright!!!!!!!!!!. Still started first time after recovery, but front end shot, roof two foot lower, every panel rooted, rear diff in two pieces. Engaged 4Hcl and drove her to that big indigenous-run cattle station just before the Nat Park (cant remember the name) and insurance took it from there.

Just my few bob's worth. In conclusion Pajero is a good car for the first 200,000km; but companies uncertainty and the previously mentioned properties do not attract people. In all aspects the latest pajero is a far superior blacktop/medium duty offroad vechile to almost anything else but resale and Nissan/Toyota heritage and future certainty do wonders for thier products.

And that current Pajero VRX, frigging ugly!!
All my opinion, of course.

Of all the cars I've owned in 35 years the Paj 1993, 3L has been the cheapest to maintain in terms of faults over life of the vehicle ,,, now 250,000 kms. Servicing was relatively cheap till about 3-5 years ago when all prices went up a cross the board. 10 years 1 battery let me down and starter solenoid croaked,, other wise tops for reliabilty and ride,,, again with in the limitations of the vehicle.

A I said in previous post horses for courses.

Barry

Thanx to everyone who put in their 2 bobs worth.

Some very interesting views I must admit.

Looks like I will need to go the TOJO way as I plan on some real offroad next year when I retire......

Grrr!!!

What!!! Did ya finally get to clean the PAJ out?

S'pose that's now 2 loads eh!

Grrr!!!

Hey Crazy Dog,

I think that most of us who have Pajeros just go about our business doing the things we want to do and not bragging about it. We have vehicles that we bought because they will do that with very little fuss. I certainly have no doubts about how tough mine is but I also know that unless I want to spend money on lots of mods I can't go where a heavily modded Tojo or Patrol will go. I would happily put it up against one with similar minor mods as mine and think it would go ok, do some things better and some things worse as you would expect but I wouldn't get excited either way if you know what I mean. If you need more room then get a car with more room, horses for courses.

I have argued before about what I think are false beliefs on the benefits of the resale value of cars like the Prado, you have to actually do the maths properly. If you pay say 55k for a Prado where you could buy the equivalent Pajero for at least 5k less (lets not get into details about the features such as traction control that you would not get on the Prado :)) and at the end of two years the Prado might still be worth 40 while the Pajero has gone down to 35. Each car will have cost you the same while you have been paying interest and insurance on an extra 5k with the Prado. Even if the Pajero was worth less the cost of the interest and insurance will leave you short. Try the figures if you buy the version of the Prado that you need to get traction control. Worst thing about the Pajero is the petrol capacity but that can be bumped up to 150l for about 1k which is still less than the difference in price.

Anyway none of that will convince anybody who believes their brand is better, try to convince a ford fan that a holden will win Bathurst :).

Tim.