guns

Will someone post that popcorn eating GIF for me please?

Mike Harding :)

Brentos,

I cannot think of anywhere you would travel in Australia where a gun is needed for self defense.

In places like crock country in some places across the top end, it just requires a little commonsense and alertness when around rivers and other waterways. Even if you had a gun, the lizards are a protected species.)
I have taken my 3.4m tinnie along the Mary River fishing for Barra (got two good size ones) and seen a few crocks, but they are as wary of you, as you are of them. (unless you go for a swim)

As for the high profile Ivan Milat & Bradley Murdoch incidences, well I would suggest these are very remote indeed and you would be in more danger crossing the road at home.

Leave the gun at home and it cannot be used against you.
Just enjoy the experience of remote travel mate.

Bill.

I know some members carry firearms for various reasons, but I don't see the need.
Most travellers will never find themselves in a situation that needs lethal force. You'd probably be better off with a loaded baseball bat.
Is it actually legal to carry a firearm in all states ? Registered or not ?
You don't point a firearm at anyone unless you intend to kill them.
Under what conditions would you do that ? Are you in a position to be able to judge when your life is at stake, or when the local drunken lads are just having fun ?
What if the murderous intruder at night is just a local on his way home from the pub that stumbles into your camp?
Some justify carrying a firearm by saying that they would use it to kill snakes (you'd need to be a cool customer and not a nervous nelly to do this..better to just get out of their way I rekkon). Some might use it to kill animals injured by contact with vehicles...
but few people would need to use a firearm to do this very often, surely ?
Unless you are very experienced with them, or need them for work, I suggest that you leave them alone.

Ok guys, you can blast away at me now. I make an easy target :))

I've got 6 rifles and a over under shotty which is minimum legal length, it easily breaks in two and can be stashed in a small spot in your car.
If I was travelling Oz and camping remote grounds i wouldnt hesitate, whether it be for protection from animals or nuts!

Cheers, Wayne

PS; by the way i'm not some gun toting nut so no bashers please!

Why, tell me a story.

Maybe we should all be driving around in 2 wheel drives if we mostly travel on tar/gravel roads.
We dont need 4bys right?

I carry a rifle most times in the outback (securly locked away) I started doing this afted having the unplesant duty of trying to beat a severly injured Kangaroo to death with a hammer that some less than nice person had left lying dying in the middle of the road
It may not have been any more pleasant but a hell of a lot easier if I had the rifle
To date I have not had to use it but if needed its there
Also it makes food a lot easier to gather if stranded its an essential bit of gear in very remote travel
My opinion
Kev

Still waiting footloose?

I don't own a gun, but am not against them. I'd probably use one for the rabbits and foxes on my place if I had one.

I find it a shocking idea that you would carry a gun for some dangerous situation you imagine in Australia. The beauty of our country is that we don't need to do that.

I if you are thinking about the few situations where mad blokes have attacked and killed travellers, I don't think any of the victims would have had time to get to a gun, load it and use it.

Meanwhile, the presence of a gun could mean that people get shot. A wrench or tyre lever would be more easily grabbed and used.

I have camped out all over Oz, both by myself and with my children. Sometimes difficult people have been encountered, but none that couldn't be sorted out by talking or driving away.

Animals? I simply can't imagine a situation where you could protect yourself, unless you walk around carrying your gun.

Maybe if you are stranded, you might use it to kill food.... but there are other ways.

It's a very disturbing thought that ANYONE travels or carries a gun unless they are a farmer, policeman, vet, hunter... for legitimate use. 'Just in case"..... scarey!

Guns dont kill people.......bullets do! oops, he he he!

All gun accidents have the same cause, the loose nut behind the butt! ;o)

No one should carry steel fencing pliers in their vehicle, you might accidentally cut a live high voltage wire and electrocute yourself - pliers are killers - leave them at home.

Guns are just another tool - used properly they are little real threat to anyone.

The problems arise when people don't use them as designed / intended.

Vehicles are deadly weapons - some 6000 people a year are killed in Oz in auto accidents - yet no one would suggest travelling round Oz on foot because driving a cars is inherrantly too dangerous?

Cheers

I have a question for the people who argue that a firearm should not be carried for personal protection and, keep in mind, Australian law does not permit one to so do anyway:

what plans do people make for their own and their families protection when travelling in remote areas in regard to the possibility of coming into contact with “Bad People”?

Do they take a knife, the proverbial base ball bat etc or do they simply hope such a threatening situation will never arise or that they’ll be able to talk their way out of it if it does?

Mike Harding

Crikey. the old gun debate. I dont think its necessary to own a gun for self defence. I find that pathetic. I am sure that you werent given your license under the need for self defence. For hunting or recreational use i am all for it but not for aiming at people. But there are always 2 sides to a debate so i will try and see it from the other side. I am young and i know what some young idiots are getting up to these days, so i would hate to camp near any young city punks, all pinging off there heads on ice and alcohol. And with the increase in unprovoked attacks on people these days, the one hit killings and such, makes you think about what these young pricks are thinking. If i had my family near them then yes i would like to have a gun. But i would probably just prefer to leave before anything did happen. I would rather head home and cut my trip short, rather then spend time behind bars. Who will protect your family then.

We all think its pathetic that every American has a gun under there bed or in there draw incase of self defence, so why must we follow everything they do?
And surely if you were travelling you would have the gun dismantled for safety reasons and in a locked hard case, so if anything did happen then by time you assembled the rifle and loaded it, it would be too late. Or would you just leave it loaded on the back seat between the kids so its ready to go? I think there are a lot of paranoid people out there.

Brentos,
Would you take a gun for self defense?
NO, hunting maybe, self defence no.
You see the only ones allowed a firearm for self defence in this country are the police, military and politicians who have armed police and military to protect them. You being part of the great unwashed rabble are expected to call the police for any self defence requirements. They usually arrive at least an hour late with a body bag, a camera and a clean up crew, so no self defence with a firearm for you.
Apart from being in many shades of bleep e for defending yourself with a firearm in then first place, if you survive the actual encounter you then have the safe transport and security of the firearm laws to contend with, which if you've managed to shoot someone you haven't been following. The police also take a dim view of you doing their job for them, especially in Victoria.
Read the firearm act for the states you plan visiting, they are all different despite JWH flushing nearly 1/2 a billion dollars down the toilet on our national unified gun laws and steal backs, you may need to upgrade the container you hold the firearm in, sticking it under seat isn't good enough.

As is usual for the popcorn munchers, the original question has been largely ignored or sidelined by many respondents.
The urge to name call or justify gun ownership appears to be irristible.
Lighten up guys.
(I'm surprised that someone hasn't mentioned that their first line of defence would be SWMBO. Judging by comments in previous posts, some of em must be pretty fearsome :))

Hopefully brentos, you've already got the best known weapon to mankind - i'ts called a brain and if you use it well, it'll keep you out of pretty well any trouble you need it to.

And you already have one of the worst known weapons - kills thousands nationally each year. It's called a car. But you can use it to keep you out of trouble too.

I've lived about 50/50 in the bush and the city. I know for sure I feel a LOT safer in the bush.

Not sure of the connection, Mike. Boxes like that don't often work.

I've owned many guns in my lifetime. Nowadays I don't have one - just don't see the need.

Might be different if I got real hungry though....

Gidday

What this thread need is a dose of reality.

Picture this:

Your all settled around the fire at night, when all of a sudden the bad guy walks in with a rifle or whatever.

You say to him:

‘Can you hang on a minute mate while I get the keys to unlock the rifle in the car? Then I’ll have to open up the other box to retrieve both the bolt and magazine.

Have a bit of a chat to the missus and kids while I’m away......should only take me about 5 minutes before I’m ready to protect the family’ (sic)

A rifle is a tool, much like a shovel. The only valid reason I can think of for any person to carry a weapon is hunting, sport shooting on a range and the need to put down damaged animals, or vermin.

Some of the comments on here make me shudder and give responsible shooters a bad name. The last thing we need is a bunch of ill informed fellas running around carrying guns for self protection.

The Boogy Man is'nt out there folks.

Regards

Kim

At the end of the day brentos, dont exercise your right to get a weapon or you too will be a gun nut!
And defineitly dont transport it!

Question answered.

Cheers, Wayne

Just had 3 wild dogs chase a kangaroo across our camp (walkers crossingLitchfield NP) caught it 20mts from my 5 yr old and started mauling it i ran to the truck grabbed a machete in case they chased her and screamed at them they let go for a brief second and then went at it again they were large bull mastif looking things. Another camper drove to rangers station to get ranger he got there to late. Its made me think what if they grabbed her So my thoughts are if your licensed and want to take a gun do so and just because we don't always agree it doesn't mean we should ridicule there opinion's if what there doing is legal Cheers Tony

I'm not a gun owner, but there is nothing wrong with those that are, in the main.

For personal protection, short of carrying a pistol in your pocket, the chances are a rifle/shotty won't be accessible when you need it for protection.

If Australia gets to the point that I need to wear a shoulder holster whilst I sit around the campfire.....well I'll book into a nursing home.

We used to camp, years ago, with a family whom the father of which was a Cop. Each night, he would load his AK 37 with a full mag of shells and sleep with it beside his bed.

Perplexed individual indeed.

Jim.

Quite some time ago .. the majority of 4wd owners carried firearms for a variety of reasons.

Now the majority of 4wd owners appear to be against firearms.

Just goes to show the how things have changed.

I guess its because things get bought now as entertainment rather than out of nescessity.

The " I'll buy a gun because I can " attitude is what spoilt firearm ownership in australia ... I have no doubt that the same will occur with 4wds ... especially as its all ready well and truly started, with the bullbar drivel.

Get yourself a bloody dog, will protect you and your family from all sorts of nasties. And do a bloody god job of it too. From crocs to wild dogs, to those psycho blood thirsty outback characters and even the boogie man. You dont need to load it either its self loading. Easy solution. You can even sleep easier at night cause the dog will do all the alerting and protecting. Hang on, you could even use it around the home to protect from the F@CKEN REAL PSYCHOS THAT PROBABLY LIVE IN YOUR NEIGHBOURHOOD. Pathetic, pathetic, pathetic. Does your wife need to hold your hand while you go to the toilet aswell.

I own a rifle but i would never ever let it become an object for self defence. Why would you wanna go camping if you even remotely thought that something terrible could happen, with which you would need to aim a firearm at someone. Please dont let your behaviour ruin it for the rest of us. Why not get yourself a dog, some pepper spray, even a taser of some sort but please dont teach your kids that its appropriate to have firearms for self defence.

Who the heck cares bout guns - they don't kill people!

I've never yet seen anyone killed with a gun - not even in war time - its the bullets that are responsible!

Ban Bullets - problem solvered! ;o)

Everyone should carry a gun - in public - its just that no one should be allowed ay bullets!

Too easey why dopeople make simple subjects so tough?

If we want to stop road deaths - do we need to ban cars or just petrol(diesel, LPG etc).?

Why do we always have to get the bull by the d!ck - when it'ssposed to be grabbed by the horns!

Get over it - guns don't kill anyone!

I've legally caried guns for personal protection and no i wasn't in the army or police - I was a payrol officer in days before direct bank debits - Iused to go to the ban every Friday and withdraw large sums of cash on behalf of the govt, to pay ther employees!

The govt issued me with a Fabrique Nationale Arms deGuerre (Browning) .32 semi auto pistol...for my ownpersonal protection.

I ALSO got a armed Policeman (.38 S & W back in those days) escort.

Back in those days - bad guys DID rob armed payrols - I think one Ronald Briggs perpetarted WA's largest ever armed robberies on a armaguard truck.....

He was subsequently caught, jailed and eventually released back into society.

Subsequently our Finest in Blue (put there to protect us) re issued him with his firearms license! :rollseyes:.

Yep hes done his crime and done his time - and now he's a legal firearm owner again!

Those who place their "trust" in ur police to rotect us are fools living in a dreamers paradise that doesnt exist!

There are bad people in this workd - it pays to realise that and act / take precautions as aresult.

It's up to each individual what precautions to take.

I've been licensed to own and carry all manner of firearms privately and for the govt for more years than many here have been outta nappies.

I'm not specifically pro or anti firearms - I'm really ambivalent - i don't see it as relevant - people kill people - thery might usea bullet to do it - so ban bullets if you want to ban something - thats easey to do but banning guns is way harder (and stoopid).

Say Guns were banned - but not bullets!

Everyone would be safe then?

What about the guy whp gets hold of a smokey designed for a spear gun - puts a non banned bullet in it - attaches it to a broomstick and waits behind a bush for his victim, then pushes the broomstick againstthe back of the victimns head and shoots him without a gun =- using just a bullet?

See = it's bullets that are the REAl problem - banning guns is no real guarantee!

Why would anyone use a smokey i hear you ask?

Geee - lets see - no barrel as such and definitely no rifling lands, hence no way to trace any weapon back to the killer via ballsitics!
Not licensed anyway - this not traceable to anyone once disposed of, even if subsequently found

The perfect murder weapon in fact! ;o)

I see so much crap posted about guns!

In our firearms act theres no mention of guns - they are called firearms, and even aloaded round of ammunition is classified as a firearm.

Ergo - IF you are found in posession of a single round of caliber of ammunition (loaded, i.e.primed powder and projectile in place) for which you don;t own a licensed firearm - you can becharged and convicted under our act of being in posession of an illegal firearm.

Example - you jump in a farmers ute - popinto town to get milk & bread an the police stop you and find a farmers loaded .22 round in the ashtray....and hes not with you - and YOU don't have a firearmns license for a .22 then guess what?

You in heap big trouble pale face!

Who here actually knows enough abut firearms and firearms laws to be able to even rationally debate the issue?

Carrying a firearm for personal protection is mentioned in the act for certain classes of firearms license holders including police and security (cash transfer) officers as well as otherspecial people like CCC investigators / protection agency staff etc.

Some of the statements made inthis thread are baseless and lacking in fact!

Do weneed personalprotection in outback Oz?

The Ivan Millat and other cases - (The Kimberleies one and the NT one involving the Lees woman & boyfriend would suggest our society sadly is fast heading that way)!

Do I carry one when outback camping? no I've never felt the need despite the fact I could if I wished!

Cheers

Brentos

I am a shooter, I have guns, I eradicate vermin.

I am a responsible shooter !.
I would never think of carrying a rifle around Oz, to protect my family. No need.

Me thinks you been watching too many movies, and if you do happen to carry a firearm, and conceal it, good luck getting it out and loaded up in time, just to protect your family.

Keep your crap off this forum.

Bucky

Brentos

Well, it is an old chestnut and as you can see brings out the best (worst) in all.

The question you actually need to ask yourself before you deliberate any further about this is “Am I actually willing to kill someone else” regardless of the situation.

Now I’m sure there will be a plethora of hypothetical situations that can be advanced to test the resolve of this question. But it all boils down to you making an instantaneous decision to pull the trigger on a firearm with the intent to kill another person. That is before we get to the question of whether you can do it successfully.

If you can get beyond that question in the affirmative than you will find you are in a significant minority, regardless of what people actually say they will do. The military have interesting statistics on the willingness of people to actually shoot with the intent to kill; you’ll find the number who actually do is not as high as you would think.

Leave it at home; you’ll enjoy yourself more without that sort of responsibility hanging over you.

Good luck

christ this turned into a debarcle!!thanks for some of the stupid replies f@%k off and argue somewhere else!! personally i don't even own a gun
but i do have a firearms license though.
i have 8 weapons that i carry with me at all times(hands feet knees and elbows) if i ever need to use them against people.

but,as i said what about if your in croc country or there some kind of wild animal where there may me a increased risk of an attack on humans or to put an animal out of it misery
nobody ever thinks anything is going to happen to them
just like hoons

regards brentos

In answer to your question,
I personally do not think one needs to be armed with a firearm to travel this country of ours.
SWMBO and I have done block 3 times plus have crossed every desert we have without incident.
Yes sometimes I want to shoot some noisy persons but on the whole people are very friendly. The further one gets from so called civilization the better the people are.
So leave the gat at home and enjoy what this country has to offer.

Mention firearms here and you'll get EXACTLY the same ill-informed, hysterical, self righteous babble you get from the anti 4WD lobby. You lot belly ache relentlessly about those idiots.......we'll take a stroll through the hall of mirrors boys and have a loooooong hard look at yourselves.

Try substituting the word 'guns' for '4x4' - or even 'bullbars' for that matter. It's a seemless fit. Go on.

Some of you blokes should have a look at the original question, and then read some of your replies. You come across as an A1 bunch of sanctimonious tossers with a mindless mob mentality.

I've humanely despatched numerous injured animals in the past, and provided food for both myself and plenty of others too (when ACTUALLY travelling off-road). This is a good enough reason in my book. To me a good rifle is just another standard part of your kit. Practically every station owner carries a rifle in his 4x4 that I've met - does that make them 'gun nuts' or '4x4 menaces' as well?

How times have changed.

Gday,

"Alicia Sorohon leaped on to the head of the 4.2m crocodile after it snatched 34-year-old Andrew Kerr from a tent where he was sleeping with his wife and infant son at Bathurst Bay, in the remote far north of Cape York Peninsula.

The huge saltwater croc snapped Kerr's arm and leg before turning on the woman clinging desperately to its back, breaking her arm also and inflicting other wounds to her body.

The struggle ended when Sorohon's son, Jason, shot the crocodile."

Mmmmm na, No reason to take one.

Cheers