Today Tonight are running another report on four wheel drives

Submitted: Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 13:13
ThreadID: 9587 Views:1953 Replies:16 FollowUps:23
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Yes, the monthly anti 4wd show again... Must be a slow news week?

To: All Four Wheel Drivers

Today Tonight are running another report on four wheel drives. Tune in
at 6.30 tonight to hear the latest horror stories.

Should you feel inclined to comment to Channel 7 after they air the program, please let us know about your telephone calls or copy to us your emails and correspondence.

If you telephone Channel 7 to complain, please remember to state that it is a formal complaint and ask that it be recorded in writing.

Regional viewers, please check your local program guide.

Regards,

Barry Chare
Secretary
Four Wheel Drive Victoria

www.vafwdc.org.au


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Reply By: William - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 13:36

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 13:36
When you see how the 4WD behave in the bush and cut up the tracks and spin the wheels unnecessarily I am not surprised there are not more complaints and tracks being closed. I find the behaviour of so many 4WD in the bush disgusting.
4WD driver drivers should be forced to go to a 5 day course how to drive and to demonstrate what the environmental disasters they cause by cutting up the tracks in a totally irresponsible way by hooning. You just have to see all the video and photographs of the 4WD hooning through bogs and cutting up wet tracks on purpose to see what a disgusting lot the majority of 4WD people are.

I would say at best 25% of 4WD people are responsible environmental thinking drivers. The rest just cut up tracks on inclines or corners from spinning wheels on purpose for no good reason other than to show off or hoon or cut up wet damp or muddy tracks on purpose. Generally speaking the 4WD community are their own worst enemies and deserve everything they get thrown at them including all the bad publicity. Perhaps we need to levy an extra licence charge on 4WD to engage police in the bush on tracks to catch these people. No other solution because generally 4WD drivers continue to be the most irresponsible bunch of idiots. I see it every trip.
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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 13:49

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 13:49
"4WD driver drivers should be forced to go to a 5 day course how to drive and to demonstrate what the environmental disasters they cause by cutting up the tracks in a totally irresponsible way by hooning."

It would be like normal car license. They would do the course, (by the way who is paying for my 5 days off work? and for the course?) and like a car license test, forget it all. Like heaps of things, you do it cause you have to, then .....

"I would say at best 25% of 4WD people are responsible environmental thinking drivers."

I think ya dreaming.

"No other solution because generally 4WD drivers continue to be the most irresponsible bunch of idiots."

Ahhhhhh didnt realise this was only a troll, apologise..
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Follow Up By: Member - Alan- Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 14:06

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 14:06
I wish people wouldn't keep advocating ever more licenses whether it be to drive a 4by or go fishing or whatever.
It does absolutely nothing except employ more bloody bureaucrats and officious busy bodies.
It won't improve the behaviour of low life on or off road, in carparks or the bush, it won't stop pillocks running over their own kids in driveways, and above all it won't stop other drivers with nothing better to do with their time, bloody whinging about 4 x 4's for one reason or other!
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Follow Up By: Moose - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 14:21

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 14:21
"I see it every trip". Why the bloody hell don't you take down some rego numbers and let the authorities know? Your lack of action is almost as unforgivable as the actions of the morons who drive irresponsibly.
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Follow Up By: glenno - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 14:59

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 14:59
what about all the large buses on fraser island wrecking the place . the tracks are rooted .
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Follow Up By: Old Soldier - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 15:46

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 15:46
Hey Truckster,

Careful mate - you'll have that whacky volvo bloke getting "up you" again :):)
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Follow Up By: David N. - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 17:44

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 17:44
William
what you say may be partly true..... for a small minority of people. To suggest only 25% are reponsible is way off the mark IMHO. Even a 55 day course/licence wouldn't change the behaviour of the irresponsible few. Certainly I would say all those I go 4WDing with are responsible.
There will always be idiots and the best defence is NOT more licences and regulation.
This country runs on red tape.
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Follow Up By: Mark from Getaway Portable Refrigerator Hire - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 20:06

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 20:06
William, You want 4wders to do a 5 day course and as a 4wder yourself, as you have stated that you do trips, you would do the course yourself?
May I suggest that this course be mandatory for ALL drivers so that it include 1/2 hour on 4wding and the rest on how to drive on the road ie advanced driver training. People of all ages are getting killed on the roads through poor driving skills but this does not appear to be an issue with you or if it is are you suggesting a 10 day course?
Sure there are hoons and cowboys out there but that is a fact of life in all walks of life and to state that 75% of 4wder's are in this category is a gross overstatement and undermines the excellent work carried out by Tread Lightly and Track Care.
Pick up your bat and ball and go home.

MarkGetaway Portable Refrigerator Hire
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Follow Up By: mik*2 - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 20:20

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 20:20
ahh William,

Are you same bloke who complains when you're behind a 4WD and can't see in front of them, never mind if you were to get any closer you'd have the front of your car resting on the tow bar of the vehicle in front of you. your sort forget that if you slow down, or heaven forbid, change lanes you can then see what is happening, or even better, just be patient. So then does that mean that since the Kia Carnival and the Rav4 are the same size, but the Kia a 2wd, the Kia should also be taken from the road or the driver do a 5 day course. It seems to me that alot of these people who complain about big cars such as these have no idea of camping, 4wding and so if they don't like it, why should anyone else.
It seems that there alot of people who have nothing better to do than complain about other peoples interests rather than get on with ther own lives.
Should I then, and every one else get rid of my 4wd dual cab that I use for work, and play because I am an irresponsible 4WD'er, or be made to do a 5 day course. How would you know? You must of travelled alot and seen so many people to reach your figure of 25%. That figure is rubbish.
If some one wants to buy a 4WD then that is their choice. If they take it off road or not is nobodies elses business. OK, some of these cars are alot bigger than some people are used to but in the end that is their business.
I am more worried about tossers "hooning" in their V8 cars with no experience with a fast car. Or motorcyles dragging of at lights and racing.
William where do you get your figures from? Is it just a guess, I think so.
Are you the same person that would winge if he had to do the 50kph speed limit on a suburban back street cause you have an auto gearbox and the car can't go any slower?
I think to be fair, the license class should change. Here in Perth you can drive a large car such as a Patrol or L' Cruiser, (just the first 2 cars that came to my head) on an A class license. Maybe people should be made to do the license test for a small truck or bus.
There will always be idiots driving not just 4WD's but all types of transport, there will always be idiots riding motocross bikes, there will always be people who make the mistake of walking in front of a car or going through a stop sign.
I seems that Today Tonight have run out of stories again so a re-run of an old faithful that they know they will get a reaction to is the way to go.
Hey, you're not employed by Today Tonight are you?

just my opinion
cheers
mike
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Follow Up By: Chris (W.A.) - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 21:57

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 21:57
Since when can you go 4x4ing and not do a little bit of damage?

I don't mean the plants etc but the track itself. If you have to go through a boghole for example what do you do?

Do a u-turn? That's just defeated the purpose of low range. Obviously if it's a deep one and you know that you'll definitely get stuck without a doubt then maybe desist and retreat.
All tracks I've been on around the Perth area change from season to season and this would most likely be attributed to weather and 4x4 usage - which is what it's there for.

If you went down a track where there's no level of difficulty you may as well take a normal car.

I don't 'cut up' or carry on like that but if there's a track that's not closed I'll give it a go rather then say, "oh, it's not like bitumen, let's turn around and go home"

Some tracks to get through require high rpm and may throw abit of dirt/mud/water all over the place but that's just part of it - there's no set speed formula for every little obstacle.

Nice southerly coastal fishing trip someday.
Chris
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Follow Up By: ExplorOz Team - Michelle - Friday, Jan 09, 2004 at 00:16

Friday, Jan 09, 2004 at 00:16
Just by way of interest William you might be interested in the results of a recent poll we ran last month of this very site asking for this group of readers viewpoints on 4WDs. Interestingly enough 91% voted that most of the 4Wd adverts we see on TV, and in mags etc are irresponsible, and show disregard for the environment. You can check out various posts on the issue as there was hot discussion on it. What this result tells you is that from the 1/4 million readers we have on ExplorOz each month - a large slice of the industry - 91% are indeed very concerned about the environment and the way that drivers behave. This group do not believe that these images portray in mainstream media are indicitive of themselves. Just thought you'd be intersted in some actual statistics we have on the issue.Regards Michelle,
Spread the word - ExplorOz.com
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Reply By: Davoe - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 14:01

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 14:01
I own A 3 t landcruiser campervan powered(or not) by a 2h diesal I wish it had the power to even spin the wheels let alone create environmental damage
AnswerID: 42228

Reply By: brighty - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 14:19

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 14:19
ahhh, another critic!!!!
Have you not heard of all the good that 4wd clubs throughout australia do for the environment and community. These people you call idiots are some of the most community and environmentally friendly people out in the bush... apart from maybe..... you!!!
As a member of a local 4wd club in NSW we are regularly ( once every 2-3 months) having working bees cleaning up our state and national parks as well as some favourite 4wding spots. All on a volunteer basis, and a fun day made of it with BBQ lunch and a few good laughs. In one day we might clean up as much as 20-30 wrecked cars and not to mention a few tonne of rubbish left by the "real idiots!!" But do they ever televise these good deeds done by 4wd groups and clubs, I think not!!!! So next time don't just look at the minority and categorise all of us under one label as "idiots" We too are looking to savour the environment, if not, what will be left for us to see of our beautiful country in years to come.
cheers,
Brighty!!!
Happy 4wding. :-))))
AnswerID: 42232

Reply By: Mick - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 14:58

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 14:58
Our Sydney 4wd clubs regularly have massive cleanups around 4wd tracks, pulling out stolen burnt cars, and industrial waste. We do this so we can still have places to go and spin our tyres and get away from our every day city living.
I love spinning my 39.5" boggers, they make deep grooves so other people to get bogged in!
AnswerID: 42240

Reply By: Member - Toonfish - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 15:02

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 15:02
same bleep differant day really
email them and let them know how ya feel

william get a life (what are you even doing on this site?)1999 NISSAN NAVARA DUALCAB
DIESEL 3.2 & SPRINGY CARLTON TOY
2 awestruck kids (dads driving!)
AnswerID: 42242

Reply By: Clarry - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 18:39

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 18:39
Today tonight is a junk TV program..... the few times a year I stumble across it, or the ads I see from time to time about the show confirm that it is made for the "feeble minded, easily infuenced" demographic. Forget it......you should worry when a show with credibility runs such stories......but they never do......why ? Serious journos and their editors can't find much heat in the subject."This is a situation, up with which, we should no longer put ! (W. Churchill, on plans to reduce 4WD access in some parks).
AnswerID: 42263

Follow Up By: mik*2 - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 20:23

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 20:23
yep, should be buried in the same hole as A current Affair.

cheers
mike
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Follow Up By: Bonz (Vic) - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 21:49

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 21:49
They have holes for these shows?Laterally Literal
Seriously Cerebral
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Follow Up By: Member - JohnR - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 22:36

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 22:36
Bonz, of course they have holes for these shows. Between some ears.Regards

JohnR - Not enough of the right travelling, some here..... some over there.......
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Reply By: maverick - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 18:59

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 18:59
I don't about everybody else but 6.30 at the moment is Nigella and melted chocolate and cream and............... rgds
AnswerID: 42265

Follow Up By: GaryInOz (Vic) - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 20:51

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 20:51
SOLD!!!!!!!!!!!!! Much better viewing, and I might even learn to cook if I wasn't so distracted.......
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Follow Up By: MikeyS - Friday, Jan 09, 2004 at 21:33

Friday, Jan 09, 2004 at 21:33
And where do these cooking shows get off... encouraging wanton consumption of unhealthy high cholesterol stuff like chocolate and cream, spilling it all down her fingers and all over the benchtop. Bloody irresponsible. Should ban all cooking shows while we're at it...
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Reply By: Viola - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 22:23

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 22:23
Darling some of the rubbish I see left behind by 4WD clubs and groups is disgusting
Darling what good is it taking any licence plate numbers as you cannot get anything done
Darling if you 4WD clubs claim to be so good how about taking a challenge darling and getting the rubbish cleaned up at UTM Zone 55H South Easting 346422.3 Northing 5864045.8 GDA94 Darling the location is SSW of Flowerdale 4.878 km
Darling do not worry I do not really expect any action from any 4WD club from what I have seen of their activities
AnswerID: 42283

Follow Up By: Member - Bernie. (Vic) - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 23:02

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 23:02
Lots of clubs have special clean up days or weekends
If you want info check out some of the 4WD club sites
unfortunitly cannot post any pic's here.

Check out the work done & still being done (next Working Bee Aust.Day Weekend) for the 03 bushfire victims.

Obivously not in a club to see what they do & a group of 4by drivers does not mean they are in a club.

Seeing you have the map cords did you send them off to DSNE or local shire office ?

Cheers
Prado TD Auto
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Follow Up By: Nomad - Friday, Jan 09, 2004 at 00:47

Friday, Jan 09, 2004 at 00:47
Oh Darling!!!

I hope you're paying a licence fee to Jeanie Little for the use of her signature.

Strewth Mate, is that the best you can do?? Would you like some suggestions for TV watching?? You must be so bored to sit down and write this rubbish!!

Get out there and see what really is happening.

Cheers (I think)
Nomad
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Reply By: Member - JohnR - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 22:32

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 22:32
Truckster unfortunately I was out working when it was on and I am interested to read the comments of William beneath your posting, well hardly. It was interesting that he has made some major generalisations that are completely unsubstantiated. Twice in his first paragraph he refers to 4WD without the drivers showing it is a magor exaggeration. He then goes on to make the statements.

In his second paragraphs he actually seems to indicate that eventing is as people normally drive their 4bys, he has seen videos of such, so that is the way we normally behave. What utter rubbish! I agree with another comment made on the forum, I would have extreme difficulty spinning wheels of my truck.

Travelling is what this forum is about, and the people who contribute here. I have seen such eventing in controlled circumstances on videos too. Hardly the norm. People here are more concerned about their insurance than voiding it, making sure they get traction than to minimse it.

William I think, seems to have a barrow to push and it is not the same direction as the direction of the people here. I think it may be to let in a higher taxing regime that will saddle up more regulation as a cover to that regime. I remember the 4by tax we had in Victoria a few years back. Jealousy tax.

I am glad he does not go to the areas I go because in my limited tripping in 4bys I have not seen his 4by hoons, though I have seen plenty of people without enough traction in two wheel drives. I have driven hundreds of thousands of kilometres in 4bys as it turns out, partly in my job. I have seen a 2by as a hoon machine rather than a 2+tonne 4by, I agree with Mike on that a lot.

William is a toy windup merchant.Regards

JohnR - Not enough of the right travelling, some here..... some over there.......
AnswerID: 42284

Reply By: rolande- Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 23:10

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 23:10
Truckster,
You have been out with your Four Wheel Drive Victoria buddies hooning through the bush just as I have, why else would you have diff locks and snorkels, etc, because you really NEED THEM! Yeah right, if you and your buddies toned it down a little then William would be seen as the real looney, (Nothing personal William, I can recognise a good jape when I see one), unlike Truckster mate who IS the original looney. Remember the TRACKWATCH system, good idea, until every idiot from the city drove down to completely ruin tracks we had asked them to stay away from as they were in danger of degredation. We stopped listing tracks as it was actually better than trying to tell your buddies to keep off them. FACT not FANTASY
Rolande
AnswerID: 42290

Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Friday, Jan 09, 2004 at 00:31

Friday, Jan 09, 2004 at 00:31
Nice try, but I dont have Diff Locks.
I have a snorkel for saving me $1000's on engine rebuilds if I find water too deep..

Ive been on a few club cleanup trips, track clearing trips, how many you been on?

Game over Try again.
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Follow Up By: rolande- Saturday, Jan 10, 2004 at 22:22

Saturday, Jan 10, 2004 at 22:22
Have photo's of about 10 actually, removing car bodies to the tip, cleaning up walking tracks, removing rubbish from camp areas, YOU?????
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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Sunday, Jan 11, 2004 at 00:46

Sunday, Jan 11, 2004 at 00:46
I have bleep loads of photos.. WHERE?
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Reply By: USERNAME123 - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 23:36

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 23:36
Rolande,

I have to say i resent what you wrote, yes everyone knows someone that is a hoon in the bush but having diff locks would actually prevent people from doing "donuts" and snorkel are just from river crossings and better quality air intake. And just because there are a few hoons out there DOESN'T mean all 4wdrivers are!!.

get you facts right next time.
AnswerID: 42296

Follow Up By: rolande- Saturday, Jan 10, 2004 at 22:23

Saturday, Jan 10, 2004 at 22:23
Not saying all are, just some people putting themselves on a pedestal with comments when reality not the same.
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Reply By: USERNAME123 - Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 23:41

Thursday, Jan 08, 2004 at 23:41
also i would just like to say that i have been a member of a 4wd club for the past year and in that time i have been on nearly 20 track clean up trips because i for one wont the tracks to stay open!. I have also gone out by myself and cleaned up a few tracks.
AnswerID: 42297

Follow Up By: rolande- Saturday, Jan 10, 2004 at 22:24

Saturday, Jan 10, 2004 at 22:24
One year membership, well done, you only have 16 more to catch up.
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Reply By: Nomad - Friday, Jan 09, 2004 at 01:01

Friday, Jan 09, 2004 at 01:01
Aw Geez fellas we are really getting into it here aren't we??

Probably 95% of 4WD'ers are responsible people. Sure, there are hoons out there, but I believe they are a minority. Anyone who wants to hoon around in a truck worth up to $50-60-70K is either mental or incredibly rich.

Yeah I've seen the donuts in the desert claypans, on the beach at Fraser and anywhere else you care to name. These people need a kick up the arse!! But do not put everyone else in the same boat.

Get their number and dob them in. Yeah, sure a lot of times the Coppers will not do anything, but weight of numbers and a follow up on what happened with your complaint will eventually have some effect.

Cheers
Nomad
AnswerID: 42306

Reply By: Member - Terry- Friday, Jan 09, 2004 at 07:31

Friday, Jan 09, 2004 at 07:31
Hi Guys
Point of fact, if you take the rego No of these hoons and report it to the relevent authoritys something can be done.
Was down at Bendethers july last year camped next to a group og young fellas who gotbleep, chased the wild live (one wombat killed) and generallly did damage to the area. Reported them, the driver was hit with 20 charges including DUI and neg driving, pledged guitly to all but last two mentioned, goes to court late this month.
Cheers
Terry
AnswerID: 42314

Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Friday, Jan 09, 2004 at 17:39

Friday, Jan 09, 2004 at 17:39
I would be very interested to hear what happens next month to the prick.
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Reply By: Clarry - Friday, Jan 09, 2004 at 09:23

Friday, Jan 09, 2004 at 09:23
Toldja ! .... watched the segment on TT as flagged...... superficial attention to a topic that was pointless, ill-directed and ineffective in its treatment. Typical for these 6.30 slots it seems. "This is a situation, up with which, we should no longer put ! (W. Churchill, on plans to reduce 4WD access in some parks).
AnswerID: 42320

Reply By: Dave from Fraser Coast 4WD Club - Saturday, Jan 10, 2004 at 00:07

Saturday, Jan 10, 2004 at 00:07
Folks, why get steamed at these obvious trolls.

True members and contributors to this site are much better educated and would not say such things, by reacting, we only endorse there attention seeking behaviour.
AnswerID: 42423

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